Enoch Powell

But that is not to say that he was wrong and that you are right, and lets not forget that the American government sustained the Khmer Rouge as a geopolitical counterweight capable of destabilizing the Hun Sen government in Cambodia and its Vietnamese allies at the time.

"When Vietnam intervened in Cambodia and drove the Pol Potists from power in January 1972, Washington took immediate steps to preserve the Khmer Rouge as a guerrilla movement. International relief agencies were pressured by the U.S. to provide humanitarian assistance to the Khmer Rouge guerrillas who fled into Thailand. For more than a decade, the Khmer Rouge have used the refugee camps they occupy as military bases to wage a contra-war in Cambodia."

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/US_Th ... olPot.html

If Noam Chomsky was wrong from his position on the radical left he is counterpoised by right wing figures such as National Security Adviser, Zbigniew Brzezinski who played an important role in determining how the U.S. would support the Pol Pot guerrillas. So who is to say what a reliable source actually is! Probably the most unreliable of all the fence sitters.

Astana, did you read what I wrote? Chomsky blamed the victims of the Pol Pot regime for the tragedy that took place in Cambodia between 1975 and 1979 because they did not follow Angkar's orders. Think about it. Do not think about U.S. carpet bombing of Cambodia prior to the Khmer Rouge victory, the Nixon Doctrine or Kissinger's lies. Think about what Chomsky wrote. If you support that kind of statement...up to you.

Finally, what does Chomsky and Cambodia have to do with Enoch Powell?

Yes, I did read the text in your post and I don't agree with it.

Clearly the article did not hit its intended mark. Simply put it is not the immigrant but the effects of conquest and colonial hegemony that is the fundamental issue and this is what Enoch Powell missed out in his analysis of the situation at the time and I felt that using the first part of the article would illustrate this and bring the debate into today's world.

By the way I had no intention to post the whole article but I felt that I should having been accused by Jack of violating the forum rules. Mustn't upset the self-elected moderator, it is a shame more public spirited forumites don't come forward to volunteer their services.

Astana wrote:"When Vietnam intervened in Cambodia and drove the Pol Potists from power in January 1972, "

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/US_Th ... olPot.html

In addition to academic theft, you quoted a source with incorrect facts. The Khmer Rouge were in power from 1975-1979. The Lon Nol government led Cambodia in 1972.

jackspratt wrote:You violated more than forum rules, when you pretended to be the author (I suspect intentionally rather than by omission) in your first post of Mosaddeq's work (ie intellectual theft) , and then followed it up with a giant dummy spit when challenged.

Who are you to spout chapter and verse using words like violated, pretended, suspect intentionally, what makes you so right! The fact is absolutely nothing.

If you believe I have broken more than forum rules, please be my guest and take me to court in any jurisdiction you'd like (I'll be happy to provide personal details), if not shut the **** up and that goes for you too Tilokarat.

"In addition to academic theft, you quoted a source with incorrect facts. The Khmer Rouge were in power from 1975-1979. The Lon Nol government led Cambodia in 1972." Quote from Tilokarat.

Here's another one using the I'm right your wrong persona, academic theft. Please read through some of the drivel that you spout particularly in using music video without copyright permission, once again what makes you so right! The fact is absolutely nothing.

Information garnered from the net can and is used daily by millions for a million and one uses, perhaps you'd like to China rules adopted here and there wouldn't be a forum to put your Jackboot on.

Astana, of course you are correct whether you believe the Pol Pot government was responsible for the deaths of so many people in Democratic Kampuchea, or you follow Chomsky and believe it was the fault of the people who did not obey orders, and be enthusiastic enough in following the DK leaders.

You are also correct, I think, about the youtube copyright policy.

However, the people who believe that the Khmer Rouge ruled Democratic Kampuchea from 1975-1979 are correct. Those who believe that the Vietnamese overthrew Pol Pot and his henchmen in 1972 are out to lunch.

I see that this thread has drifted onto other issues, like blaming Europe for all the evils of colonialism (What about Japan, China, the Ottoman empire, the Incas, the Aztecs, in fact any successful empire). Also Guns, with a highly inaccurate and biased opinion on the crusades. What i hate is when anyone tries to regurgitate crap as fact. if you wish to make such sweeping statements, check it first. The historical entries on Wikipedia are amazingly detailed and with few errors. but what some write here is pure opinion and twisted propaganda.

(ok, i know global warming is furiously debated at times, but at least both sides do try to use some factual evidence).

As for the original posting, I just think that a FIRM but FAIR immigration policy would have resolved most problems; you need control, not bans. Also migrants claiming their 'human rights' are being violated in UK is a joke - if it is that bad, go somewhere else.

humane rights only exist in uk for ethnic and bad guys. not for law abiding poeple. or tax payers. i wish we had some thai laws here. i live in udon but here in uk for a short while. we could do with a new enock powell.

The fact that Enoch ( as I shall call him ) spoke with what he knew or thought then, it is easy for us to either ridicule or even to poo poo his remarks, as we are speaking with the benefit of hindsight and history has a way of making even the most outspoken person appear to be a hero or even the reverse.

Immigration IF properly managed is a valuable tool in managing the movement of man across the globe, however history has shown us that in fact all counbtries and races have over the years used colonization to push its own agenda, from the Visigoths to the Chinese etc:-

Mankind is a cultural mix and yes mistakes were made and are still being made, but now we have an whole army of people who look over our shoulders and tell us what we should or should not do. Human rights is often quoted whereas 50 years ago, no-one thought or even cared about that at all.

We are reaping what we sow and as the waters become muddier and new countires and races flex their muscles we as a species are in a constant flux.

While it is nice from the peaceful environment of our own houses ( rented or owned) to push forward writings or comments about what happened or what we consider will happen, most of us are what is probably termed as the twilight of our lives ( the last 20 or so years ) and we have the luxury to speak as we find. Lets us pause and think about our children or even our grandchildren being born these past few years, how are they going to curtail or even manage the movement of differing peoples all seeking something better elsewhere.

To me the problems seem immense and as I do not have a solution to hand ( apart from a cull) I personally do feel that we have left them with a problem which if not dealt with in a sensitive and managed way could bring about the demise of many people .

I do not envy them their task just hope I am not around whenever that happens.

i had the pleasure of attending a meeting , where enouch powell was talking about selective immigration . the man was not racist . he wanted immigrants who could contribute to our economy ,
not bleed it dry . in my humble opinion , he as one of the last of members of parliment ,
who stood by what he believed in , whatever the consequences .
a far cry from the YES MEN , OF TODAY .

jackspratt wrote:

Astana wrote:Information garnered from the net can and is used daily by millions for a million and one uses, .............

Isn't that one of the great things about the internet

But please don't pretend it is your information, when it is not.

If you accuse you should prove intent so since you can't you should retract.

what would the thai people do if the thai gov gave all farangs or imigrants in thailand benifits and houses but refused thai;s the same.like we do here in uk or europe. i think i know

MALC wrote:what would the thai people do if the thai gov gave all farangs or imigrants in thailand benifits and houses but refused thai;s the same.like we do here in uk or europe. i think i know

nice one MALC,
the thai goverment giving houses to immigrants ., bad joke.

we can pay our hard earned money to buy a house ..
but we cannot own the house ...

theres a lot to be said for this third world country ..