Latest TRC intrim report English PDF file

At last they have highlighted the infamous hidden assets of Thaksins that really does show him and those in authority to judge his false declaration as unproven, ignored the rule of law and found him not guilty on a 7-8 vote in his favour.

Go to url http://nationmultimedia.com/home/admin/ ... ortEng.pdf and then to page 19

What many did not know at the time including myself and no doubt the foreign media who reported on it, it was a 7-6 vote against him with 2 abstentions.

Abstentions are null and void supposedly by law, but......................

They took it upon themselves to use the 2 abstentions as not guilty votes and he was then proved innocent on the 7-8 majority.

WTF

Rather than keep on about 2006 and the illegal coup, may I humbly suggest it goes back to 2001 ( not as mistakenly quoted as 2004 in the PDF. by the way )

He should never have been in power in the first instance nor most importantly the TRT party and all the lawlessness that followed !!!

Perhaps they should find a way of re investigating the reason why ( the TRC ) if they really are serious about reconciliation, otherwise for many it is just a sham what they are doing and starting 5 years on aprox. half way through the causes of when the unrest and dispondency actually began between the various sides of society

marshbags

"He should never have been in power in the first instance nor most importantly the TRT party and all the lawlessness that followed !!!"

I can't help but think back to the 2000 presidential elections in the US .......if only that inspector had ruled correctly on that hanging chad ballot, we wouldn't have had to deal with George Bush for 8 years.

Is the country going to try and resolve its problems with Thaksin (or whoever) by looking back on something that may (or may not have been) illegal 10 or so years ago? Although, now that I think of it, if the whole Thaksin thing was a sham, then everything afterwards falls into the same category. And that makes going back to the 1997 constitution that much easier to justify.

marshbags wrote:
What many did not know at the time including myself and no doubt the foreign media who reported on it, it was a 7-6 vote against him with 2 abstentions.
[color=#FF0000]
Abstentions are null and void supposedly by law, but[/color]......................

They took it upon themselves to use the 2 abstentions as not guilty votes and he was then proved innocent on the 7-8 majority.

I am sorry I don't know about your country but here in Thailand and also in England there is no such thing as abstaining in a jury vote. The judge looks for a majority verdict, guilty or not guilty. If the decision is split equally he will ask them to go back and reconsider. If they are still unable to decide he will announce he is prepared to accept a majority verdict. Now that is not a majority of the votes but the majority of the jury members. So in the case you quote of which I have no knowledge, there are 7 voting guilty and 8 not guilty. 6 positively and 2 unable to say guilty .Making the nots the majority.

Your maths re the voting is not correct TB.

Initially the vote was 7 against and six in favour.

The majority was therefor against , the inclusion of the abstentions is not required and most certainly should not have been counted as votes in favour of the offender.

The two who did not vote for whatever reasons made thus their votes void and in any case they should not have ben used for either a guilty or non guilty outcome.

Constitutionally it was as stated a distortion of law and leads to serious ambiguity.

The law was distorted in this case and the goverment had not carrried out proper investigation as required to do so.

Hence a re investigation and the exposing of the reasons why ( as if the majority need to be told in an unofficial capacity ) is the least that should be done.

It really is a sad state of affairs when we have so many continually going on about reconciliation from the coup and all that it alledgedly is responsible for, when by the same token choosing to ignore the unlawful election of the person who causes / caused the problems in the first instance.

As with the HR issues of which it is seemingly one set of rules for the alledged May attrocities involving 91 deaths and another for several previous ones.

The infamous EJK,s ( 2500 plus and the 83 T Bak victims to name but two ) seemingly do not to this day matter, and are still unaccountable, un investigated while the recent 91alledged offences become a priority.

For sure both need investigating and the latter one is presently, locally, by this government and the selected panels.

Thaksin of course gains to benefit by this, while the EJK,s ect. are are most definitely not going to help him.

As for Thaksins election being a sham Parrot your right 100%.

Regarding the 1997 constitution it would not be a problem in the same instance as it would not have been altered and minipulated by the TRC CEO and his party to benefit corrupt practises as happened and have shown to be responsible for much of the trouble and unrest of today that was born from it all.

The present government only want to go back to it so they can once again minipulate and intepret it to favour themselves, there supporters of a certain colour, plus their unlawful leader in exile, first and foremost of course.

Jack of course states it as it is and yes the end result will be as most expect it to be, meaningless.

marshbags

I am not discussing the case linked to or indeed any other particular case . I am simply pointing out that a judicial majority whether it be by a jury, panel of judges or by any other name , is not the same as a voting majority. Some may have noticed I referred to English law not British, that is because in Scotland they do have a third choice to guilty or not and that is "Not proven" Which means that you may think the accused is guilty but the evidence presented is not sufficiently strong enough to say so"without reasonable doubt."However you don't want to vote Not guilty. Now a guilty verdict must be by a majority of members so it stands to reason that this third choice is virtually the same as an abstention but , and this is important, it is not a guilty verdict, so can only be included in the tally of the not guilty ones.
It is certainly not a case they can be ignored from the tally or that it is deceit to add them to a not vote. They didn't say "guilty". , Making the majority of members unable to vote guilty. Therefore the ones that did were in the overall minority .End of case .

Without being rude I find it difficult to understand what your last post is about in relation to the TRC report , Thai law and the fact that a 7-6 vote found against Thaksin was dismissed / ignored ??? and to facilitate the overturning of it they unlawfully used and added the two non votes to the not guilty ones and declared it a verdict in his favour of 8-7....( surprise surprise )

Anyhow this is the latest this morning relating to comment on TRC report and includes other controversial observations on reconciliation.

Please go to url :- http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion ... 71784.html

Overlooking certain political offences is a fair comment, but how the more serious incidents can be dismissed is beyond reasoning, especially the the extreme cases of violence and mayhem, hell bent on terrorising, injury, loss of life and causing destruction ect. and the additional cases of the deliberate burning of the governmental offices throughout the country ect. ect.

Arisman and any other major leaders involved should be tried fairly and transparently and sentenced according to law.

Without political interference or the manipulating of laws ect. and the constitution to facilitate a not guilty verdict for what was a very public evidence display of unbelievable hate and giving clear intructions to their supporters to commit a multitude of offences and incite rioting throughout the country.

The democrats have already said they do not want a blanket amnesty as it will allow anyone and everyone who fits in the above, and of course yet another way for a certain exiled fugitive to escape justice, according to Thai Law, not only for the conviction he already has, but several other charges he is wanted for and need to be addressed.

They said they will accept and any legitimate charges filled against them and defend themselves as and when required to in court according to Thai Law.

Personally all those found guilty in a transparent and proven way irrespective of who or what the represent, are given what penalties according to Thai Law, they deserve...big time, without parole or the usual letting out of jail while dragged out appeals are in acted to escape punishment.

marshbags

Sorry marshbags. To use your expression, without being rude, I don't know how much clearer I can be . I stated my reply had nothing to do with any particular case, yet alone the one you mentioned. It was solely to correct the erroneous comment you made on the verdict .

Well I did think I made my point very clear that even an infant school kid could understand . Obviously I was wrong .

It is obvious that any dreams of having genuine reconciliation are a long way off and never going to happen while the Government and it,s red shirt protectors continue to follow their established agenda,s.

Please go to the following url for full details and some remarkable observations from Thida Thawornseth, chairwoman of the red-shirt movement for her insight into the TRC and certain sections within

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politic ... 71873.html

To say that unrest ect. wasn,t initially started by the unlawful findings of Thaksins concealment case and developed there after is beyond reason and shows her along with the other one sided interpretations of right and wrong that their can never be a fair solution ( to benefit all Thai citizens and voters ) until their is a mega shift towards reuniting Thailand, which is surely supposed to be the main objective of the PT according to their manifesto and repeated declarations on this important matter.

Sure the government got a huge majority but anyone thinking this was soley due to getting the fugitve ex CEO back are taking the voters as a whole for granted and treating everyone as brainwashed idiots.

The P.T. set out an agenda which contained several vote seeking pledges of which several had the most attraction in getting the support it finished up with.

Many really could not give a hoot about Thaksin and his self imposed exile to escape justice and prevent other charges to be brought against him and could not care a satang on getting him back to carry on his dishonest deeds.

The 300 baht which was supposed to be implemented once in power ( not next April, if it even happens then ) was possibly the biggest voting factor and many workers must have been sold by it,s pledges to everyone.

15,000 minimum wage per month for all those of a pre specified qualification, including those recently achieving success in their respective fields at University ect. ( not a chosen few or selected areas)

Several promises made to benefit students and education, helping the farmers and giving them immediate funds and credit cards ect. ( what happened to them or their implemetation as promised.)

Before the floods started just in case anyone mentions them.

It is reasonable for all to expect priorities to now focus first of all on the the rebuilding of the country and getting the homes of those effected and the super strucure of the many that are destroyed rebuilt.

The provision of a scheme to hopefully prevent future disasters happening on such a scale ever again with all parties invovled and participating in debate and finding solutions.

Making sure all monies and funding is honestly used and not for the notorious feeding bowls of the chosen few and to be supervised by a group of individuals of the highest proven integrity who can make sure it is not corruptedly mis used.

It is obscene to even think about anything else or make daily statements of intent regarding the selfish individual in Dubia ( or possibly elsewhere ??? ) for one.

Those considered a risk and accused of serious offences against the state and the nation should rightly be kept in a secure place until they are tried, especialy those for which compelling and visual evidence to back up accusations available and has been in the public domain for all to witness since the committing of them.

This is not politiacal pursecution as the propagander machines would have everyone think and in particular Thida Thawornseth and MP,s of her party, especially Jataporn whatever who has promised chaos should his priviledged status be lawfully taken away.

Genuine reconciliation to benefit everyone and the country, not individuals and giving prominent positions to those associated with the recent turmoil as a reward for carrying out their violent agendas and causing chaos along with terrorising those who would beg to differ with them and assist the PT to get the majority it now benefits by.

marshbags