at what stage do you think you are ?

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semperfiguy
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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by semperfiguy » January 9, 2017, 8:46 am

Hoopoe wrote:Once you realise , it's all about survival , ( not a battle ) survival you can attempt alone or with friends , A battle is against the opposition , you are alone , if you think in this country someone is going to stand along side you in the battle ( there will be a lot of noises saying yes yes yes , ) you will be alone , ,
I think this is what you are trying to say Hoopoe!

LIFE LESSON FOR 2017

When we think the grass is always greener on the other side, sometimes we end up in trouble!
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Colossians 2:8-10...See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, which are based on human tradition and the spiritual forces of the world rather than on Christ. For in HIM dwells all the fullness of the GODHEAD bodily; and you are complete in HIM, who is the head of all principality and power.

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by pf-flyer » January 9, 2017, 9:36 am

For me these stages are a process that never ends. For me it is an issue of the heart and it is an internal issue. You cannot escape it by jumping onto an airplane running away because it will go with you no matter where you go. I have failed plenty of times. I have had plenty of failed expectations. Failure and disappointments are a part of life. It is not a way of life. Failures and disappointments are an event. It is not a person. Failure is something that you have done. Failure is not what you have become. We can choose to learn from our failures. We can learn to respond to what has happened to us in a way that helps us to rise above the negative influences of the past. What matters is what we do today. When life experiences fail to respond to our expectations, those unmet expectations can cause us to be frustrated, hurt or angry. Dwelling on those disappoints will only make us more down trodden, angry and irritable. That is where dealing with the issues of the heart come into play. I need to remember that my wife has issues of the heart also. The first year (1973) in the U.S. was the worse for my wife. We lived in a remote farmhouse out in the country. She told me several years later that there were times when she was alone she would secretly cry her heart out because she desperately wanted to go back to Thailand and She knew she could not ask to go back to Thailand because we did not have the finances to send her back to Thailand. She deeply missed her home, her culture and her family. She lived thru those stages also. She is precious to me and I love her more than anything in this world.
"Life is like a tube of toothpaste. Outward pressure brings out the inward contents."

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by d p meijer » January 9, 2017, 4:32 pm

thinking and feeling exactly the same about everything said .

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old timer
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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by old timer » January 11, 2017, 11:23 pm

semperfiguy wrote:I was so used to being in control of all facets of my life, but the minute I got off that airplane in Udon I had to surrender the most important aspect of my phyche. The hardest thing for a leader to do is to become a follower, and in the blink of an eye there I was like a little puppy dog wagging his tail behind his back
Yes semperfiguy this is what happens, and I for one will not give up X amount of years earning respect and controlling everything to let a Isaan villager wether that be a WFB, wife, girlfriend or whatever take that away.
OT can't speak a lot of Thai really, but enough to get by and I will never take advice from anyone in Udon about anything, most of it is related to hearsay, Buddhism and unsustainable business ideas which fail if attempted.
I really don't understand and probably never will what makes a man become "a little puppy dog", but there are plenty of them in Udon and I don't mean that to offend anyone.

OT....... \:D/

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by pf-flyer » January 12, 2017, 6:06 am

I know exactly what you are talking about. When I was working at the University. One of my responsibilities was the electronic and electrical maintenance on a 2 MEV Particle Beam Accelerator in the Physics Department. When we made our first trip to the electric company when we were building our house; 3 of the family members who thought they knew everything insisted on going with us. When we entered the electric company office and approached the desk I was told by the electric company employee at the desk to go over and set down by myself so the family members who thought that knew everything would have a discussion with him. I was really pissed off and I said to myself "'I just don't give a shxt.". When they were done having their discussion and we were back in the car getting ready to go back to the house my wife told me that they did not accomplish anything. It was only when my wife and I returned to the electric company several days later WITHOUT the expert family members that we had an intelligent discussion and we were able to make the arrangements to have the electric installed. Now that we have been here for several years those expert family members have begun to realize that I am not that ignorant and stupid just because I am not fluent in the local language. I realize that I will always be dealing the mindset of some of the locals who assume that all of the farangs are ignorant and stupid and most of them are alcoholics. My wife family members has really come around to realize that I am not that stupid. I cannot say that for allot of the other locals living in the village.
"Life is like a tube of toothpaste. Outward pressure brings out the inward contents."

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semperfiguy
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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by semperfiguy » January 12, 2017, 9:22 am

old timer wrote:
semperfiguy wrote:I was so used to being in control of all facets of my life, but the minute I got off that airplane in Udon I had to surrender the most important aspect of my phyche. The hardest thing for a leader to do is to become a follower, and in the blink of an eye there I was like a little puppy dog wagging his tail behind his back
Yes semperfiguy this is what happens, and I for one will not give up X amount of years earning respect and controlling everything to let a Isaan villager wether that be a WFB, wife, girlfriend or whatever take that away.
OT can't speak a lot of Thai really, but enough to get by and I will never take advice from anyone in Udon about anything, most of it is related to hearsay, Buddhism and unsustainable business ideas which fail if attempted.
I really don't understand and probably never will what makes a man become "a little puppy dog", but there are plenty of them in Udon and I don't mean that to offend anyone.

OT....... \:D/
I appreciate your reply OT. I really didn't mean to imply that I had given up anything to my wife, who is now retired at my request, after having taught English in the government school system for 18 years. I am in control of my household, and would never have decided to stay here if that weren't the case. Actually, pf-flyer in his reply below was more in tune to my point. When we expats come here we are at the mercy of this culture and its system of doing things, and it is so vastly different that the Western way of doing things. It's almost like going backwards from being an adult to taking baby steps once again. We take everything that we have learned and throw it out the window and start all over again. When we finally discover that we are not going to make any headway doing things "our way", then we slowly give up control in the sense that our wives become the chief negotiator, and that is a very hard thing to swallow. Granted, learning the Thai language would be a major asset in helping one to assimilate, but for some of us that is not an easy chore at our ages. Some people are able to learn new languages easier than others. I lived full time in the Philippines for 11 years and 3 years in Taiwan, and I was lucky to be able to give a taxi driver instructions to turn right or left in the local language. I have zero gifted ability to pick up the Thai language, and I'm honest enough with myself to admit it, so for now I will continue to let my long-haired translator intercede for me. As far as I'm concerned, the major obstacle for us expats is not our inability to communicate in the local language, but rather it is the absolute ignorance and inability of the majority of the locals to reason logically which keeps us out of our posture to be able to deal from a position of strength and be in total control of our circumstances.
Colossians 2:8-10...See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, which are based on human tradition and the spiritual forces of the world rather than on Christ. For in HIM dwells all the fullness of the GODHEAD bodily; and you are complete in HIM, who is the head of all principality and power.

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by trubrit » January 12, 2017, 10:54 am

On the subject of learning the Thai language my old mentor once told me, over time you will understand some Thai, enough to get by but never let your audience know you can , that way you will learn what that infamouse smile really means not what you think it does .Wise words that have stood me well over time.
Ageing is a privilige denied to many .

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by parrot » January 12, 2017, 5:43 pm

Back to my long post on page one of this thread:
There's an interesting piece in today's NYT about Central Park concerning the collection of trash there. In the article is a photo from the 1980's with a fair amount of strewn trash littering the park.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/11/nyre ... -park.html

As for sfg's comment "As far as I'm concerned, the major obstacle for us expats is not our inability to communicate in the local language, but rather it is the absolute ignorance and inability of the majority of the locals to reason logically which keeps us out of our posture to be able to deal from a position of strength and be in total control of our circumstances."........you're at a major disadvantage of trying to be in total control of your circumstances by living in a developing foreign country.......can't own land, immigration rules, can't speak the language, brain is wired for 120v while the local population is wired for subservience, Buddha and animistic thinking from birth.
Most expats I know here live a pretty contented life........subservient to the things they don't like because they know (and accept) they don't have the power to change them.

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by pf-flyer » January 13, 2017, 7:25 am

I have my boundaries. Boundaries define what is me and what is not me. Boundaries shows me and others where I end and where someone else begins. There are allot of controllers out there who cannot hear NO. They tend to project responsibility for their lives onto others. I let the controllers experience the consequences of their irresponsibility. They only live in the moment and have no thoughts about the consequences that may come to fruition. There are a lot of those individuals that always play the victim role in order to escape taking responsibility for their actions and words. Those boundaries are always being challenged.
"Life is like a tube of toothpaste. Outward pressure brings out the inward contents."

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by Barney » January 14, 2017, 2:19 pm

This morning while taking the young one to school on the bike I came upon something that made me think seriously at what stage I am at?
A man was in front of me traveling along at 30 or 40 km/HR on his bike and he had, I kid you not, a 2 or 3 yr old child in a low side laundry basket strapped to the back seat behind him.
I must be at the last stage as it did not surprise me one bit and I didn't really care.
But, at what ever stage you are at, the "shaking of the head" phase never goes away.


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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by pf-flyer » January 14, 2017, 2:52 pm

[quote="parrot"]
As for sfg's comment "As far as I'm concerned, the major obstacle for us expats is not our inability to communicate in the local language, but rather it is the absolute ignorance and inability of the majority of the locals to reason logically which keeps us out of our posture to be able to deal from a position of strength and be in total control of our circumstances."........you're at a major disadvantage of trying to be in total control of your circumstances by living in a developing foreign country.......can't own land, immigration rules, can't speak the language, brain is wired for 120v while the local population is wired for subservience, Buddha and animistic thinking from birth.
Most expats I know here live a pretty contented life........subservient to the things they don't like because they know (and accept) they don't have the power to change them.[/quote]
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[quote]subservient to the things they don't like because they know (and accept) they don't have the power to change them[/quote]
I agree 100 %
"Life is like a tube of toothpaste. Outward pressure brings out the inward contents."

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by trubrit » January 14, 2017, 3:10 pm

Precisely. Pretty futile worrying about something your not able to change isn't it?
Ageing is a privilige denied to many .

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by can123 » January 14, 2017, 3:14 pm

Farangs have to be very dim if they cannot pick up sufficient Thai language to get by. It is possible that they are just too lazy to make the necessary effort to learn it.

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by felixcat » January 16, 2017, 2:37 pm

Have been watching this thread since it started....its good some are getting things "off their chest" and others are giving feedback on what they do, and how they stay sane or insane.
Myself, a couple "sayings" impressed me many years ago, that helped form my travels and allowed me to go "anywhere" and enjoy with almost anyone in that envirorment.
"You are what you eat".."Garbage in, garbage out" , and "You get what you give".
I "give" and I get.
What is "giving"? Its not "money"
Do you smile at everyone you meet? Do you ever say "thankyou" or "arroy, or arroy, mak mak, or arroy, sap, or sap, sap?
Do you take their hand and touch them, while looking them in the eye and say thankyou?
Have you ever hugged a Thai because they did a "major' to you?
Yeah, we tend to live "in the circles we support".
Have you ever tried to get out of your "safe space" or "think outside of the box"?
OMG, the thai friends I have made, just by saying I love "pet, Pet"......Or Thai food is "the best".
They are not really "jungle people", illiterate, savages, ect. they have been deprived of a better education.
You see, just as "water and money and food" can be used against people as a weapon, so can "education".
Didn't we used to hear years ago that education is a great wealth?
I came here for the ambundance of wonderful foods..what did you come for?

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by rick » January 16, 2017, 5:10 pm

A very interesting thread, yes, i had a 'stage one' which still lasted about a year after i moved here. Never really had a stage 3 because i knew about the differences - this is the third foreign country i have lived in so was well aware that life would be different, and my second foreign wife. Also i did a lot of research before even coming to Thailand the first time - enough so i was actually impressed that it wasn't as bad as some said!

So I knew that Thailand wouldn't be the same as UK. Yes year 2 to 3 i started to see the papered over cracks, but it wasn't much to worry me. Now stage 4 except i'm to lazy to integrate well, as languages have always been a problem for me. Is life perfect? No, but where is it? Still love my home country but love Thailand as well.

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Re: at what stage do you think you are ?

Post by luaddaeng » January 17, 2017, 11:49 am

Stage 7 perhaps? Only 3 more left.

I am not retired, and learned to speak, read and write Thai when I got here. I'd already been hanging with locals big time in the mountain jungle but got tired of being wasted on whiskey, motocross, street bike racing, street fights, hunting, gambling, fighting with the girlfriend, breaking up, getting a new one, with whatever mia noi's sweating you for a few hundred baht doing "show number" too much you have to chuck the sim card.

In the party life the women (wives / main girlfriends) would go off and do same gambling partying stuff together near bottom of the mountain and us fellas would be up top. The easier for the lasses to get up to no good down there sneaky like catting about.

Sometimes a week would go by before we broke it up and all went home to the flatlands. And only a week or two before we were all partying again on the hilltop jungle. I remember some of those treacherous rides down the muddy slopes and cannot figure how we all made it down from there time after time.

But drinking and smoking and sitting and talking and joking & listening to music was basically a relentless all day all night thing even around the village home, with very little actual quiet time before someone came puttering down the dirt road to visit. Annoying really because of all the other older people gossip & the kids running amok.

So stage 5 or whatever according to what article kopkei posted. But had to sober up and just move on. Took a while but I got it sorted. Cash ran out to only a hundred k thb in the bank left after just under a million thb on arrival spent over 3 years. Got a broken heart too many times trying to get the lasses I really wanted and broke plenty in return on same of lasses looking to land me.

Finally got it out of my system and straightened up a bit and became a responsible type mate insofar as a man here considers realistic. Found a good one, she put up with a ton of ----, but we had kids and that was it, after second one it was clear she wasn't going anywhere. Just had to tough it out and make it work for the kids' sake much as the miserable old hags in the village hoped otherwise etc.

Moved closer to the big town. I got all the way off the piss and as such learned the real world here is tedious, the public schools are useless, the roads are out of hand, and I now notice more, people really do drop like flies around here. This country is hard on people. Nice if you have a cush pension life and don't get out much. But living the daily grind here it's not for many and it is probably better back home, -or is it. Western lasses a real headache, glad to be far from their braying antagonistic cow herd. I know there's more descriptive that's the short version.

I haven't had a hot shower in many years, and when pulling pants off the clothesline have to chase out the huge wolf spider that always seems to tuck in there. But the stars at night are beautiful as are the women.

A few broken bones and huge cuts aside "no proprem". All that said I DO NOT MISS THE VILLAGE one bit and the wife thinks SAME. So no going back as it were unless the bottom falls out. This town can't seem to decide if it's growing or shrinking and unless you are rich folk good luck making anything other than a subsistence living here.

But the kids are in school and we keep em' out of trouble. As much as can be done at the minute. And really can say if we can get out of here and raise them in a better land I think it would be better than them coming up over here. But where is that?

If we don't blow out of this gyp joint, -my only western request is:

When I kick the can don't put me in the temple bbq, my kids don't need to see that. Just put me in a cemetery so they can visit now and then and remember their real papa, even if it's the replacement papa that drives them there.

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