US Health Care Plan

by **WBU ALUM** » February 23, 2010, 10:47 pm

The links I provided were only posted because of the number of accusations that Republicans never had a plan. The problem since January 2009, is that Republicans have never been given a seat at the table. The open and transparent promise has really been very opaque and partisan. Democrats have fashioned their bills alone and behind closed doors. Not even American citizens have been privy to the deal cutting.

And yes, Bob, you are correct. I have no affiliation with Wayland Baptist University. However, one of my women's basketball teams beat them in the 1990s. WBU, as correctly stated, stands for Water Buffalo University.

Khondahm, your post lumped me in with Republicans, of which I am not one. I was hoping that you could recount some of my lies, since you painted with such a broad brush. But I guess you answered that. You don't have the time to do anything, but to accuse.

I would also add that the Republican minority leader went on the record at a press conference last Fall and enumerated what it would take to get Republican support. Every single one of the 5 top concerns he enumerated have been incorporated AS WRITTEN by the Republican who introduced the amendment. Despite this fact, not a single Republican vote was obtained and the Republicans who introduced the amendments suddenly became opponents of their own amendments.

Khondahm, please provide those 5 concerns and show me where they are located in the bills. Thanks.

by **Texpat** » February 23, 2010, 10:55 pm

Racist! Pure and simple. You object to a carte blanche trillion dollar health care fiasco -- you're a goddamn motherfuckin Obama hatin' racist!

This is fun!

by **WBU ALUM** » February 25, 2010, 7:29 am

The last time this boondoggle government takeover of health care passed in the House of Representatives, it was by a vote of 220-215. Four of those 5 votes in favor aren't there anymore (retirements, death and one change of heart). Add the fact that EVERY MEMBER (all 435 members) is up for election this year in November, and there will be even fewer who will vote for it because the American people are against it.

Last count, according to the political blogs and guesses and other such political online journals, there were at most 190 votes.

And then there's this: Conrad: Reform "dead" unless House passes Senate bill first

Unless the Speaker breaks arms and members are willing to end their political careers in November, the House will probably not be able to pass the current bills as written.

And by the way, the president's plan that was released on Monday does not have enough information for the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to score it (determine the cost). Everything I have read, including left-leaning media sources, believe the president's plan is more expensive than any of the others (which has already turned folks against it). Also, his plan is NOT a bill. It could best be described as only suggestions. Presidents don't write legislation.

I'm not looking for the Kabuki Theater on Thursday to be very fruitful.

by **BobHelm** » February 25, 2010, 11:48 am

Well this is good news for all Americans.
They can now go back to the existing system that costs them twice as much as any other nation, for a worse result.
A system that any cost prediction I have seen shows it will bankrupt the nation.
One that allows tens of millions of Americans not have health cover.
One that allows even ordinary individuals to be forced into bankruptcy because of illness.
Yes indeed a day of rejoicing for the land of the free & the home of the brave... :shock:

by **KHONDAHM** » February 25, 2010, 2:02 pm

WBU Alum - first, I did not know what WBU stood for, so I retract the postings about it (note also that it was a question, not an accusation) - thank you, Bob for setting me straight. And I apologize WBU Alum if it offended you unintentionally.

Now, on with the debate! :razz:

Are you aware that the House AND the Senate already passed health care bills and all that is left is to reconcile them??? The document that does it is just 11 pages long.

Really, you need to educate yourself about the opposition and what is really going on. At a minimum, you should be watching the daily podcasts of The Rachel Maddow Show. I guarantee you will learn a lot more than just the talking points you subscribe to. Hell, even I peek at www.newshounds.us every now and then - but not immediately before or after meals. Just the mention of that yellow journalism filled network makes me nauseous.

PM your email address and I will upload and send a link to the past 3 episodes (which are loaded with so many facts it will make your head explode) JUST for you because you are sssssssooooooooooooo special! $\:D/$

Yes, I know you SAY you are not a Republican, but I can SAY I am not one either. The FACT is that I would have voted for Ron Paul (the only sane Republican left, it seems) had he been on the ticket because his position on the issues were well thought out and FACTual. I don't agree with EVERYTHING, but at least he has a coherent rationale for his positions on those policies I do not agree with.

The Republican position which you continue to agree with and promote (ergo you ARE a Republican) was and continues to be utter fear-based nonsense; and the Democrat position is more hyperbole than substance - BUT it makes more sense and is grounded in far more facts and far less bluster than the Republican position.

by **WBU ALUM** » February 25, 2010, 7:42 pm

KHONDAHM wrote:Are you aware that the House AND the Senate already passed health care bills and all that is left is to reconcile them??? The document that does it is just 11 pages long.

Yes, I am aware of that information. Are you aware that the 11 page document cannot be scored by the CBO because it is only a summary/abstract and not specific regarding costs? The 11-page document is not a bill.

A fact is that either the Senate bill must be voted on in its entirety by the House (which isn't going to happen), or the House bill will be accepted in its entirety by the Senate (which isn't going to happen). That 11-page document that is not yet a bill, will have to be written in the form of a bill (probably 1,000 to 2,000 pages) and then passed in its entirety by both the Senate and the House. If there is one change in any of the language by either body, then the bill will require a vote in each body again. The current language has a long, long, long way to go; and it doesn't look like it will pass short of political suicide on the left.

Really, you need to educate yourself about the opposition and what is really going on.

You're rather long on innuendo and personal attacks, and pretty short on decorum. MSNBC has so few viewers that it may not make it through the end of the year. RM's viewership is even less. I've watched her. She's pretty long on innuendo and personal insults, too.

Yes, I know you SAY you are not a Republican, but I can SAY I am not one either. The FACT is that I would have voted for Ron Paul (the only sane Republican left, it seems) had he been on the ticket because his position on the issues were well thought out and FACTual. I don't agree with EVERYTHING, but at least he has a coherent rationale for his positions on those policies I do not agree with.

I'm happy that you're proud of your vote, but I never called your politics into question and wouldn't resort to that.

The Republican position which you continue to agree with and promote (ergo you ARE a Republican) was and continues to be utter fear-based nonsense; and the Democrat position is more hyperbole than substance - BUT it makes more sense and is grounded in far more facts and far less bluster than the Republican position.

I suppose you're too busy to be specific in your "fear-based nonsense" accusations.

by **KHONDAHM** » February 26, 2010, 5:16 am

I'm having a giddy tme watching the Health Care meeting start to finish. All the Republicans are there with their bogus arguments and fear tactics and are getting SCHOOLED by Obama and his team. It underscores everything I've posted on this thread.

The Republicans are being proven to be obstructionist nincompoops. It's a televised public slaughter. They are swaying in the wind and butt naked to the world! Many of them can't even remember their talking points and are the hypocrisies are rampant when they stray from their script.

But don't just take my word for it:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/02/2 ... 73945.html

Hahahaha!

by **WBU ALUM** » February 26, 2010, 10:02 am

Some, even on the Left, were impressed.

CNN’s WOLF BLITZER: “It looks like the Republicans certainly showed up ready to play.” (CNN’s “Live,” 2/25/10)

CNN’s GLORIA BORGER: “The Republicans have been very effective today. They really did come to play. They were very smart.” (CNN’s “Live,” 2/25/10)

• BORGER: “They took on the substance of a very complex issue. … But they really stuck to the substance of this issue and tried to get to the heart of it and I think did a very good job.” (CNN’s “Live,” 2/25/10)

• BORGER: “They came in with a plan. They mapped it out.” (CNN’s “Live,” 2/25/10)

CNN’s DAVID GERGEN: “The folks in the White House just must be kicking themselves right now. They thought that coming out of Baltimore when the President went in and was mesmerizing and commanding in front of the House Republicans that he could do that again here today. That would revive health care and would change the public opinion about their health care bill and they can go on to victory. Just the opposite has happened.” (CNN’s “Live,” 2/25/10)

• GERGEN: “He doesn’t have a strong Democratic team behind him.” (CNN’s “Live,” 2/25/10)

THE HILL’S A.B. STODDARD: “I think we need to start out by acknowledging Republicans brought their ‘A Team.’ They had doctors knowledgeable about the system, they brought substance to the table, and they, I thought, expressed interest in the reform. I thought in the lecture from Senator John McCain and on the issue of transparency, I thought today the Democrats were pretty much on their knees.” (Fox News’ “Live,” 2/25/10)

THE WEEKLY STANDARD’S STEVE HAYES: “I think to me the most important thing to come out of the morning so far is that Republicans have spent a great deal of time talking with great passion, and I think eagerness about their plans, detailing the plans that until this morning them democrats had been saying didn't exist. Well, you now see, I think, in great detail that Republicans do have plans, that they care about the same issues and that they feel passionately about it.” (Fox News’ “Live,” 2/25/10)

Republicans are listening more intently to the people of America, who in every single health care poll, reject the bills before the House and the Senate as they are now written.

As evidenced by the quotes above, CNN had a very lively and fair exchange in their analysis of the discussion.

The most important components in all of this is to provide greater access, less cost and no infringement upon the liberties of Americans in keeping the health care for which they currently pay. Additionally, all of it should be provided without government positioning themselves between the doctor and the patient, or the government takeover of yet another segment of the American free enterprise system. At the same time, there should be no further tax burden on the American worker.

by **WBU ALUM** » March 5, 2010, 9:04 am

Even though Dems have an overwhelming majority in the House, their political infighting is preventing the Senate version from passing in the House.

The social-progressive wing of the Dems want the public option in the bill. The conservative wing wants the funding of abortion with federal tax revenue taken out of the bill. At this point, it looks like the current bill will not pass.

Additionally, Republicans provided some suggestions for health care at the summit. The president said publicly that he liked four of those suggestions. However, there is a problem with adding those suggestions to the bill. The president refuses to start over and negotiate a new bill, but adding those Republican suggestions would require that the bill start over. So liking some things really don't matter.

Liberals grill Obama on health reform

by **WBU ALUM** » March 6, 2010, 12:57 am

A reasonable breakdown of the Democrat political logjam in Real Clear Politics.

Counting the Heads of House Democrats / Updated 3-5

by **thrilled** » March 7, 2010, 12:31 am

The Dems are trying to shove it down our throats.We do need A better health system ,but I predict in 10 years it will be 3 or 4 times the amount that they're saying.Just list 1 thing the us government has done right.They don't do anything right.The country would be better off if congress took A long recess ,maybe A year or 2.

by **snowman** » March 11, 2010, 3:16 am

thrilled wrote:The Dems are trying to shove it down our throats.We do need A better health system ,but I predict in 10 years it will be 3 or 4 times the amount that they're saying.Just list 1 thing the us government has done right.They don't do anything right.The country would be better off if congress took A long recess ,maybe A year or 2.

thrilled yours is best post of all. says it like is is here =D>

by **jackspratt** » March 11, 2010, 8:00 am

From what I am reading, the Dems are now looking at at using a process called "reconciliation" to get the bill passed in the Senate - meaning they don't require the 60 votes super majority.

Can one of the yanks please give us a (non-politicised) explanation of "reconciliation".

Thanks

by **WBU ALUM** » March 11, 2010, 8:18 am

jackspratt wrote:From what I am reading, the Dems are now looking at at using a process called "reconciliation" to get the bill passed in the Senate - meaning they don't require the 60 votes super majority.

Can one of the yanks please give us a (non-politicised) explanation of "reconciliation".

Thanks

Reconciliation can only be used on budgetary items. That is a Senate rule agreed upon by, I believe, 2/3 of the Senate. Reconciliation was instituted so that the government could continue to operate without a filabuster preventing it.

Reconciliation won't be a factor if the House doesn't pass the Senate bill. The Senate bill has to be passed with NO CHANGES to it. Taxpayer funded abortion is the holdup.

All 435 members of the House are up for election in November. They are feeling the heat, and as of today, it looks like the House will not pass the Senate bill.

by **jackspratt** » March 11, 2010, 8:33 am

Thanks WBU. =D>

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