Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

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sometimewoodworker
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Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 28, 2019, 11:43 am

There is a visa agency with a 02 phone number (I will not give the name or any other details due to the Thai Libel law) they have accessed the immigration email address list that includes nationality and extension information. The stolen information probably also includes age as well

I am certain of this information due to the fact that I use a unique email address for immigration. Incidentally I give a unique different email address to almost everyone, and certainly to immigration.

They tried to claim that I had emailed them or talked to them by phone, I have not (before today)

They could be a legitimate agent but seeing how they got my email address I would not be sure of that.

Am I paranoid? Maybe not enough ;)


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jackspratt
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by jackspratt » November 28, 2019, 12:06 pm

Why do you believe the data is "stolen"?

Users in Ban Dung of the Udon based agent tell me she does their 90 days reports online to Chonburi, via the immigration system ie she seems to have direct access. :shock:

I guess the day we hear reports of a real crackdown on agents is the day we will know that corruption is finally being taken seriously in the Land of Smiles.

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by Bandung_Dero » November 28, 2019, 12:07 pm

Had one of those! Calls herself Grace.
The TV thread has no clue as to her source.
Looking at the email she does not know the precise visa status of the recipient.
PS. I don't think its libelist to name a party conducting an obviously illegal activity. TV posted a copy of the email and we all know how pedantic they are.
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sometimewoodworker
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 28, 2019, 6:13 pm

jackspratt wrote:
November 28, 2019, 12:06 pm
Why do you believe the data is "stolen"?
I do not “believe” that the data was stolen. I know that it has been.

There are only 2 places where that e-mail address exists, one is on my computer, the other is on the immigration database.

There is enough other information that proves to me that the theft of data was from immigration.
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sometimewoodworker
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 28, 2019, 6:22 pm

Bandung_Dero wrote:
November 28, 2019, 12:07 pm
Had one of those! Calls herself Grace.
The TV thread has no clue as to her source.
Looking at the email she does not know the precise visa status of the recipient.
PS. I don't think its libelist to name a party conducting an obviously illegal activity. TV posted a copy of the email and we all know how pedantic they are.
Regrettably the Thai libel law is draconian and the penalties are not light.

I have no interest in discovering first hand if the actions of the lying scummy thief are enough to permit public naming (I would add shaming but I doubt they would be able to be shamed)
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jackspratt
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by jackspratt » November 29, 2019, 9:49 am

The point I was trying to make is that if the data was given out freely to a third party, or knowingly accessible to them, it probably doesn't fit the definition of "stolen".

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Khun Paul
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by Khun Paul » November 29, 2019, 11:15 am

It could also be that the Immigration server has been hacked, and they ( Immigration ) is unaware. Government servers are not known for their security or that a Rogue person is feeding intel to a third party for the statutory brown envelope .

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sometimewoodworker
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 29, 2019, 11:39 am

Khun Paul wrote:
November 29, 2019, 11:15 am
It could also be that the Immigration server has been hacked, and they ( Immigration ) is unaware. Government servers are not known for their security or that a Rogue person is feeding intel to a third party for the statutory brown envelope .
You could have got the exact situation and job of the thie. There are suggestions that that is what is happening.
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by tamada » November 29, 2019, 12:55 pm

I doubt anything was hacked. Someone at immigration may have 'sold' an email list to this agent or this agent could have 'bought' the information from someone at immigration. Either way, it appears to be an established, private business that is already doing business with a government agency leveraging that beneficial connection over their peers. Maybe the first shot in 'agent wars' has just been fired?

If members here or on TV are sufficiently upset about what appears to be the abuse of their legal data protections by a government entity, in lieu of the closure of the NCPO''s anti-corruption snitch line that has expired with the junta, they can still file a complaint with other government agencies, such as the Office of Public Sector Anti-Corruption Commission, the Public Service Center of the Office of the Permanent Secretary for the Prime Minister’s Office, District and Provincial Damrongtham Centers or directly to the responsible agency.

Good luck!

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by tamada » November 29, 2019, 1:16 pm

jackspratt wrote:
November 28, 2019, 12:06 pm
Why do you believe the data is "stolen"?

Users in Ban Dung of the Udon based agent tell me she does their 90 days reports online to Chonburi, via the immigration system ie she seems to have direct access. :shock:

I guess the day we hear reports of a real crackdown on agents is the day we will know that corruption is finally being taken seriously in the Land of Smiles.
And there was me thinking that some Udonites were simply using local agents with local addresses on their paperwork to get extensions issued by Udon IO. But the above suggests that at least one (the only one?) Udon agent is filing their 90-days through the Jomtien IO? If the whole agent thing was borderline illegal just because every immigration form states 'the applicant must appear in person' but the agent did all the walking, filing 90-day reports in the province where you are not legally resident must be flying so close to the wind that even the most jaded (and broke) old Thailand hand can see that is is fraught with danger. No matter how hard the government may come down on their own, there's absolutely no way any foreigner is going to get a free pass for knowingly using these corrupt Thai government officers and their agents. Government workers will get inactive posts whereas foreigners will get shown the door.
Last edited by tamada on November 29, 2019, 1:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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sometimewoodworker
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 29, 2019, 1:27 pm

tamada you are spot on with those comments.

Everything will be OK with the agents and the clients, until it isn’t.

Then the agents will submit the correct envelopes while the dodgy extension holders are hung out to swing in the breeze.
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BillaRickaDickay
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by BillaRickaDickay » November 29, 2019, 1:43 pm

Surely once an email has been composed and sent the host, Gmail, Hotmail etc do what they like with the info contained within including passing your info onto third parties with a relevant interest on info contained within that email.
For example: if I write a mail containing the word "insurance" as part of its content, pretty soon I am receiving emails from various companies offering to sell me insurance.
There is obviously some piece of software hoovering up all this stuff and passing it on.
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tamada
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by tamada » November 29, 2019, 1:53 pm

BillaRickaDickay wrote:
November 29, 2019, 1:43 pm
Surely once an email has been composed and sent the host, Gmail, Hotmail etc do what they like with the info contained within including passing your info onto third parties with a relevant interest on info contained within that email.
For example: if I write a mail containing the word "insurance" as part of its content, pretty soon I am receiving emails from various companies offering to sell me insurance.
There is obviously some piece of software hoovering up all this stuff and passing it on.
Not according to the legal customer privacy protections that email service providers must adhere to. Yes google and FB sucks up all sorts of random data to fuel advertising feeds but they aren't about selling email addresses to anyone, they just share i.p. addresses with revenue seeking entities. It' starts with the cookies.

If you feel you are being stalked as a potential customer online (and you are), there's several ways that you can either severely impair or totally block such legal data hoovering that won't impair your web experience.

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by RLTrader » November 29, 2019, 2:11 pm

Is someone unreasonably suspicious?

Seems so. Bet using gmail. Well known that both evil goggle along with yahoo are using AI to sniff thru ones emails, even if Not Sent and everything else.

With my Yandex account, don't even get spam. Why? Got me!

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by tamada » November 29, 2019, 2:43 pm

Going a bit off topic so bear with me here. Apart from a gmail email account, I have configured 3 others on another US -based service, one for personal email, one for work email and a third for junk. I use Thunderbird as my email client as it has robust spam detection built-in. I only use the junk email address when it's required for online shopping or for online subscriptions. My personal email is only shared with banks and non-Thai government agencies. Work is the exclusive domain of my clients and their contractors. Accordingly, the spam filters on the junk account get a workout but my personal and work accounts remain uncluttered. I would say that gmail does a pretty good job of killing spam at source and by using a simple browser add-in called disconnect.me (written by a former google builder so he should know!), my web browsing is totally devoid of advertising. It is still there (as disabling disconnect.me quickly shows) but when it is turned on, it becomes totally invisible. FWIW, on my last 90-day report online, I used the junk email address. I will take a look in that account's spam bucket to see if Grace is reaching out to me.

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 29, 2019, 6:38 pm

BillaRickaDickay wrote:
November 29, 2019, 1:43 pm
Surely once an email has been composed and sent the host, Gmail, Hotmail etc do what they like with the info contained within including passing your info onto third parties with a relevant interest on info contained within that email.
For example: if I write a mail containing the word "insurance" as part of its content, pretty soon I am receiving emails from various companies offering to sell me insurance.
There is obviously some piece of software hoovering up all this stuff and passing it on.
That very much depends on the email providers. Gmail is not a free service, you are the product, you are not the client.

All “free” email services have an ulterior motivation, from lock-in (from you internet providers) to sources of advertising revenue and data.

That is why I pay for my email service.
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tamada
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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by tamada » November 29, 2019, 10:42 pm

^ I guess I got lucky with AT&T (personal, work and junk accounts) when they realized that paid-for email service wasn't a viable revenue stream for former US residents who can't subscribe to any of their other paid domestic broadband, cable or mobile services so now my email is free.

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by BillaRickaDickay » November 30, 2019, 3:52 am

Who knows what these Internet companies get up to, lts not long ago that Facebook were fined 5 Billion for mishandling users data after their dealings with Cambridge Analytica came to light.
He's got his little y-fronts and he's got his little vest, Chaz Jankel, 1998. Mash it up Harry.

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by Hoopoe » November 30, 2019, 7:23 am

I got one of these Emails asking if i'd like to use their service for my up coming extension of stay application ,from an Agent ,.
I replied with a lot of verbals , at which they got upset about , they then telling me it was just an advert and if i didn't want to use their service , just to ignore the advert ,
All this on an Email address where extensions of stay , Visa applications have never been written about ,the I/O has this Email address , And i'm pretty sure the name Grace was used , so the real questions should be ,,where did they get my Email Address , ,how did they know my extension of stay was due within 1 month ,
I personally DGAFF , ,,,,after another set of Verbals they have not been in touch again ,
Wish i'd saved the 2 Emails for proof on here , but i just binned the lot ,

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Re: Warning, visa agency accessing immigration database

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 30, 2019, 9:18 am

Hoopoe wrote:
November 30, 2019, 7:23 am
I got one of these Emails asking if i'd like to use their service for my up coming extension of stay application ,from an Agent ,.
I replied with a lot of verbals , at which they got upset about , they then telling me it was just an advert and if i didn't want to use their service , just to ignore the advert ,
All this on an Email address where extensions of stay , Visa applications have never been written about ,the I/O has this Email address , And i'm pretty sure the name Grace was used , so the real questions should be ,,where did they get my Email Address , ,how did they know my extension of stay was due within 1 month ,
I personally DGAFF , ,,,,after another set of Verbals they have not been in touch again ,
Wish i'd saved the 2 Emails for proof on here , but i just binned the lot ,
I think that it’s very likely the same agent that caused me to start this thread and they somehow have (almost certainly illegal) access to the immigration database or an extract from that database. This conclusion comes from the information that they have which includes nationality and unique email addresses also very probably extension expiry date and age.
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