Where have all the posters gone?

[Kudjap or Bust]

OK this really is my last word ..............

Understand that about Youtube, maybe I used a bad example but you didn't respond to the removal of other links i.e. Thaivisa etc, do you not feel these are 'promoting' those websites as the 'reader' will be taken to that particular site.

What is the definition of 'promoting another website' in the eyes of the UM forum?

What actually is the aim of having the ability to add a link to a post? If it's going to take the reader away from UM then surely they are all breaking the rules as this must be deemed to be promoting the other website.

These are your/forum rules may I suggest you stick to them in all cases and not when and where you feel it pertinent

[lee]

Kudjap I believe Bob gave a fair explanation for removal of the UT link.

With regards to other links, they are normally removed if we consider them to be spam. For example a new poster joins up and posts a link to a mobile phone website, this may be considered spam and removed.

Likewise links with the sole intention of promoting a business or service may be deleted also.

I personally have not seen any links posted to intentionally promote thaivisa, youtube, bangkokpost etc. Normally these links are posted to accompany news items, or in youtubes case to host online videos.

[BobHelm]

Thank you for your advice.
I will treat it as I feel fit, as it was not requested. As far as I am aware you are not the owner of this site, so when a variance comes in how I and the other moderators apply the rules I will defer to his request.
As another has suggested before if you do not like the rules of the site then you have a number of options open to you. You have now exhausted the 'discuss with a moderator' one; so I suggest you try another.

[english.farang]

Question to the Mods: Do you feel UT is a threat to UM?

Well I am not a mod or have any desire to be so I cannot answer for them but I would like to ask you what sort of "Threat" do you envisage the mods and I guess by implication, Admin might feel ? The founders of UT said right at the beginning they are self sufficient and are not actively seeking sponsors. So it doesn't appear that there is any need to feel a financial threat . Membership? Well as I see from the stats The Map attracts more new members every week which far surpasses the total membership of UT . So not that .Content then? As the previous posts have indicated some posters prefer the organised , moderated style of UM whilst others prefer the undisciplined, minimal moderation of UT .
Some even like a bit of both .So I don't see any threat there .Which leads me to ask again . What sort of threat do you envisage the UM team may feel?

First and foremost I would like to point out that UT is a new forum, in its infancy, (5 weeks) I wonder how the figures would look if one was to compare UM first five weeks

Yesterday UM: 134 new posts, 6 new topics, and 2 new members.

Yesterday UT ; 258 new posts 11 new topics and 34 new members

So your submission holds no water, once again incorrect facts posted by you

Truebrit I seem to remember that on at least two occasions, you were so upset with the moderation and other posters not agreeing with your somewhat pedantic views on here, that you got into a tantrum and said you would never post again

You seem to be intent on trying to derail the new Udon forum's attempt to give an alternative to this well established and respected forum.

As for your attempt in another thread to dissuade members from having anything to do with UT because of its content, I find rather childish and below the belt, whats your problem with them did somebody disagree with something you posted

I would like to point out that I am not a member of UT, but regularly read it.

I would also like to say that Lee's previous post; "Personally I think UT is a good idea and I wish the organizers the best of luck in the future. " is commendable and a sensible outlook =D> =D>

I will continue to read both forums, even though you suggest I should not :-"

[Kudjap or Bust]

Lee, I agree that there may not have been any links that promote Thaivisa or other websites I was merely making a point and being slightly argumentative after Mr Helm quoted a rule stating if a reader felt a link was promoting a site it was breaking the rules (or words of that ilk). The link posted to UT did not promote the site, it was purely further information regarding a service in Udon.

I personaly still believe, and I know you won't agree nor will Mr Helm as he has said in not so many words he doesn't give a stuff what I believe, that the link was removed out of some kind of spite against UT or it's founders or maybe some of it's members who have jumped ship from UM. Mr Helm would and will never agree with this, after all this is the land of 'not losing face'. IMO his explanation wasn't that acceptable and stank slightly of pushing the forum power he holds too far. He after all did kind of say he has some kind of disrespect to those who called him a liar/facist, persons no doubt now encamped on UT. Whereas I wouldn't like those kind of insults either when you're a Moderator you need to take it on the chin and get on with the job of moderating. As I mentioned above I've done the moderation bit and some people don't like your actions. No problem, explain yourself to all and move on to the next one. If, when a Mod removed a link or deleted some text etc etc they added a post as to why it has been done it makes it a little easier for members to accept and understand, maybe something that can be initiated.

I am an avid reader of UM and will continue to do so but it has been apparent over the last 4 years that I have been a member that the Mods have in some cases negatively increased the actions of their power wielding axes. IMO of course.

END OF MY INPUT...............

[jackspratt]

My last word honestly (unless asked a question).

OK this really is my last word ..............

END OF MY INPUT...............

C'mon KB, admit it - you had your fingers crossed behind your back when you wrote this

(Come to think of it, that would make typing rather difficult )

[trubrit]

English Farang! It would appear that you are intent on starting to personalise this topic by turning it into an attack on me .Well may I suggest you start a new topic for that purpose or would that be asking too much, it has after all taken you nearly two years to make six .Or do you normally post under another name and just save this one so you can hide behind it when being belligerent? :-"

[jackspratt]

First and foremost I would like to point out that UT is a new forum, in its infancy, (5 weeks) I wonder how the figures would look if one was to compare UM first five weeks

Yesterday UM: 134 new posts, 6 new topics, and 2 new members.

Yesterday UT ; 258 new posts 11 new topics and 34 new members

e.f where do you get the above statistics relating to UT?

When I just looked at it, all I could find was:

Total posts 4844 • Total topics 342 • Total members 133 • Our newest member sweatysock

[bumper]

Well I have always posted on several forums, most have been gracious and forgivening to me. Both the forums in mention have been. I joined this forum when it was reasonably new, to learn and offer help where I could. It has served me well. I won't abandon it. But, I will use the other forum as well. Sometimes it feels really stupid, heck I only have so much to say. That can end up a duplicate posts on both forums.

I wa attacked on the orhre forum for my spelling and motorcycle postings. But in PM's not where a discussion could be had. I really didn't need that in my life. I don't like debate. They backed me up as Lee has in the past. So I will continue on as I am with no complaints in either direction.

[trubrit]

e.f where do you get the above statistics relating to UT?

When I just looked at it, all I could find was:

Total posts 4844 • Total topics 342 • Total members 133 • Our newest member sweatysock

Perhaps he has insider information Jack, or possibly an administration key. :-"

[english.farang]

English Farang! It would appear that you are intent on starting to personalise this topic by turning it into an attack on me .Well may I suggest you start a new topic for that purpose or would that be asking too much, it has after all taken you nearly two years to make six .Or do you normally post under another name and just save this one so you can hide behind it when being belligerent? :-"

I'm so sorry if you think my post was an attack on you, I thought that I was only responding to your post, so why a need for a new topic?

No, I am not using another name my names not Val. Just because I have only posted 6 times in nearly 2 year means nothing. I'm not being belligerent, I'm just speaking the truth, and FACTS.
I take it that your defensive posture is because of your lack of ability to respond to the valid points I made in my last post.
As normal casting innuendos

e.f where do you get the above statistics relating to UT?

When I just looked at it, all I could find was:

Total posts 4844 • Total topics 342 • Total members 133 • Our newest member sweatysock

Total posts as of yesterday 4844, total post previous day 4586 = 258
total topics as listed "new topics" last 24 hours.
If you care to look under members, you will see by date the New members and the dates they joined, as I stated above, only posting FACTS

Truebrit, once again your last post childish

[jackspratt]

Total posts as of yesterday 4844, total post previous day 4586 = 258
total topics as listed "new topics" last 24 hours.
If you care to look under members, you will see by date the New members and the dates they joined, as I stated above, only posting FACTS

Thanks.

[trubrit]

Total posts as of yesterday 4844, total post previous day 4586 = 258
total topics as listed "new topics" last 24 hours.
If you care to look under members, you will see by date the New members and the dates they joined, as I stated above, only posting FACTS

Truebrit, once again your last post childish

Wow . Mathmatics. Now I may be childish but that seems a lot of work for just a casual reader, not even a member????
Seven posts now

[Dublin Tony]

I am surprised that other than jackspratt no-one has questioned the gentleman trubrits accusation that he was offered hardporn access by the administration of UT.
This is a very serious accusation and the offer could only come from the webmaster or the moderators.
I feel strongly that the administration at UT should be given a chance to deny this accusation or otherwise.
After all,these individuals are known to many people in Udon and they deserve the chance to defend themselves "innocent till proved guilty."
I think also Udon Map sometimes "shoots themselves in the foot" by deleting posts without the courtesy of notifying the poster.I am sure that many of these deletions are more than justified but a short message to the poster along the lines of......"I am sorry we had to delete your post as,in our opinion,it contained inappropriate material or was abusive to another member etc.etc."
The poster might not agree with the deletion but at least you have had the common courtesy to inform him/her and not appear too high and mighty to think that the posters views count for nothing.

I,personally,think think that this post of mine is both fair to UT and Udon Map and trust that it will not end up in the Recycle Bin !!

[bumper]

Come on guys in the end does any of this really matter. Just enjoy your day.

[trubrit]

Dublin Tony. It wasn't an accusation but a fact. I have a copy of the PM but of course it has the senders name on and I don't want to personalise the issue by pasting it here .It wasn't an attack on UT, just my reason why I felt UM shouldn't link to it .What they get up to is no concern of mine, especially as I am no longer a member. It should be noted. I suggested to the mods that in the interest of harmony between the forums they may wish to delete .However Admin and two moderators from UT had posted on here before it was removed and had every opportunity to deny or at least comment on the issue .Maybe like me now , they feel the least said the better .

[bumper]

You know I sometimes I just forget for people that is a good day. =D>

Me I'm s proned to anger I have to stay out of the mix

[Dublin Tony]

Come on guys in the end does any of this really matter. Just enjoy your day.

bumper,
No I suppose it doesnt matter to me but surely the Udon Talk administration deserve the right to deny this accusation ?
trubrit has a copy of the pm so I dont doubt that this happened BUT all the Udon Talk admin will come under suspicion for this accusation.
I dont doubt that there are some really decent guys on Udon Talk admin and it isnt fair that one bad apple amongst them should slur the characters of them all.
But,yes,lets just enjoy the day.I wont mention it again.

[lee]

Since we're on the subject of moderation I thought I'd throw in a little background on udonmap.

Udonmap started back in November 2003, at that time it was just a couple of pages hosted on a geocities website (geocities.com/udonmap). Then January 2004 we launched a paper map and website with its own domain name.

A month or so later I added a forum (cutecast) with the main intention to post info about sponsors, and also to provide a platform for community discussions. Several people joined up and a few friendly discussions began.

The forum eventually started to fall apart because of bugs in the software so I looked for a more reliable forum system. I came across phpbb and installed it June 2005, members moved over to the new forum, just in time actually because not long after the software collapsed. Unfortunately I couldn't find a way to transfer posts over to the new forum, and eventually the software fell apart taking the posts with it.

The new forum took off, discussions picked up and lot's of new members joined up. The forum was still small with few members and unmoderated at this stage, to be honest there was very little need for except for a usual spam from time to time.

Then as the years passed forum member numbers grew, hits increased and it developed into a busy little forum. Along with all the traffic came more spam and it became apparent I couldn't handle this alone so I recruited several volunteer moderators to help me.

The extra help was appreciated and I could then leave the forum knowing I had a couple of eyes to zap any spam or porn posted.

Member and post numbers continued to grow over the years and with that came increased Spam, unrest between members, thread hijacking, etc. So to keep the peace and order we decided to follow the rules a little more rigorously. We followed this route so that the forum would continue to be a peaceful and friendly environment to post in. Also it would help keep informative topics on track and make it easier for new members to find information they were looking for.

The extra vigilant moderating approach came as a surprise to some, some thought it was too heavy handed or over zealous. This wasn't our intention, our intention was to follow the rules more closely to avoid the forum becoming a mishmash of topics going off in all directions and battleground between members.

Any forum owner will understand that as more members join and hits increase, moderation is a must to keep the peace and order. Everyone has different styles of moderating, some like it and some take offense to it. Some even think we're on a witch hunt or have personal vendettas which is certainly not the case with us.

Unfortunately you can also get posters who are deliberately out to cause unrest and arguments - often referred to as Trolls. Udon Map has had its' share of them over the years too. Rather than leave it to individual Moderator discretion rules were introduced. Sometimes it is difficult to understand the actual intention of a poster and mistakes will always happen & are regrettable.

IMO the moderating on the udonmap forum is nothing personal, it is done with the best intentions in mind. We have no axes to grind with anyone in particular. Our main goal is to make a pleasant environment for people to post in, free from personal attacks and less thread hijacking. Unfortunately you can't please all the people all of the time, as we have found out.

I would also like to thank members for their input over the years which has helped put 'udonmap' on the map, you know who you are.

[Dublin Tony]

I agree with everything you say,Lee,an excellent post. =D>
I think Udon Map is a great little site....very informative and pretty friendly.
But dont you think if a moderator deletes a post the poster has the right to know why by means of a pm ?
Not meaning this as a criticism.Just a thought.