Voice to Parliament referendum

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trekkertony
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Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by trekkertony » January 27, 2023, 11:09 am

Interesting…from one of the “MOB”

The following article is by Steven Tripp, Spectator Australia, 13 December 2022

Recently, I sat down to interview an Aboriginal Elder from South Australia for the ExCandidates podcast, of which I am a host. Her name is Kerry White, a former nurse and diabetes educator from the Narungga people. The aim of the interview was to determine her views regarding the Indigenous Voice to Parliament.

It was a fascinating interview because it completely deconstructed many fundamental aspects of the current ‘narrative’ surrounding the Aboriginal people. say ‘Aboriginal’ because even during the pre-interview phone call I had with Kerry, I made the mistake of using the term ‘Indigenous’

With no hint of hesitation, Kerry quickly corrected my error and informed me that Aboriginal people prefer to be called Aborigines.

I asked her to expand on this during the interview.

Kerry explained that Indigenous were ‘…anyone native to Australia including flora and fauna. If you’re born in Australia, you’re Indigenous.’

The other term that they use for us is First Nations,’ Kerry went on to say. ‘First Nations – that’s Canadian. We are not Canadian. We are Aboriginal. We are from Australia and the Torres Strait.’

Why did we move away from the term Aborigines in the first place? Was it a fear of political correctness? Obviously, we were not listening to Elders such as Kerry White. Instead, we have chosen to listen to Woke activists, university lecturers, and inner city elites.

Kerry then went on to explain the divide between Aboriginal ‘mobs’ in rural/remote areas, compared to mobs in city areas.

‘When it comes to Aboriginal people, we have two separate lots,’ she began, educating us again. ‘We have a lot of Aboriginal mobs. Not tribes, not clans. Mobs. That’s an Aboriginal term. [The mobs] are divided into two. And that is rural and remote, and that is separate from the city-ites.’

Could this explain the clear difference in message between Senators Jacinta Nampijinpa Price and Lidia Thorpe, who grew up in Alice Springs and Melbourne respectively?

How will an Indigenous Voice to Parliament adequately represent the concerns of this divide?

Kerry went on to teach us another Aboriginal term – ‘tick-a-boxers’. These represented the people who claimed to be Aboriginal when it is clear they are not. Recent census data points to this.

Since the 1971 census, the number of people identifying as Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander has risen from 116,000 to over 800,000 – a 590 per cent increase.

Even from 2016 to 2021, the national population increased by 8 per cent, but the Indigenous population increased by 23 per cent.

There should be some form of identification. Proof that these people claiming to be Aboriginal are actually Aboriginal,’ Kerry began, before recalling how almost twenty years ago, the government scrapped the need for someone to obtain proof that they were Aboriginal.

So, if you want to be Aboriginal, all you had to do is tick the box.’

Kerry pointed out that the word Indigenous is included in the official wording of the proposal – the ‘Indigenous Voice to Parliament’. Therefore, one wonders, would simply ‘ticking a box’ to indicate you were Indigenous suffice to be recognised by the new body? What can of worms would that unleash?

It must be frustrating for an Elder like Kerry. How many times have true Aboriginal Elders been asked to comment or contribute to the debate on The Voice? According to Kerry, it is yet to happen for anyone in her community.

For Kerry, her feelings on the Voice to Parliament are clear.

‘It’s a no from me. I say no to The Voice. I don’t want it,’ she replied pointedly. ‘We, the Aboriginal people from rural and remote Australia do not want it.

‘A bit over two hundred years ago, they rounded Aboriginal people up and locked them on missions. So Aboriginal people were segregated from White society. Then we come forward to now – “The Voice” – and they’re segregating us again. They’re taking us back two hundred years. ‘You’re dividing the country again, it’s back to segregation. And frankly, it’s racist towards our White brothers and sisters that live in this land with us.’

Furthermore, Kerry makes the argument that Aborigines are already over-represented in Parliament, thus nullifying the need for a new body such as the Voice. ‘We have eleven Aboriginal members in Parliament, in the Upper and Lower house.’ Kerry begins. ‘That equates to 4.9 per cent representation, Aboriginal representation in Parliament. For 3.2 per cent of the population. With that, we actually have over-representation in Parliament. So why would we need a Voice? Unless they’re saying that our Parliamentary members are not doing their job.’

Does Kerry reflect the thoughts and feelings of all Aboriginal people? Should her statements and explanations concerning Aboriginal people be taken as gospel? Of course not. But that is the point. Can a ‘Voice’ to Parliament represent all the varying ‘voices’ of Aboriginal Australia?

More importantly, is the debate on the Voice taking the focus off the true needs of Aboriginal people? As a nurse, Kerry is well-versed in the issues facing Aboriginal people, especially in remote communities.

‘With Aboriginal people, it’s mostly linked to diabetes. We have a high rate of diabetes amongst Aboriginal people.’ Kerry explains.

‘Heart problems. That began to rise about fifteen years ago. They don’t have access to medical care out there. They don’t have health centres and doctors and all that. They don’t have it. They’ve got to travel sometimes 3-4 hours to get to a doctor, or medical treatment if something should happen out there.’

Kerry White joins Senator Jacinta Nampijinpa Price, along with Senator Pauline Hanson of One Nation, in speaking out against the Voice to Parliament. Their message also stresses the need to unify the Nation, not to divide it along the lines of race. You would think that a study of history would compel anyone to agree.

We already have Parliaments at local, state, and federal levels the attempt to address all the ‘voices’ of society.

According to Kerry White, Senator Price, and surely many other Aboriginal people, this is the way it should remain.

For me, the lesson was that it is always best to go straight to the source and avoid the mainstream ‘narrative’.



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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Sport » January 27, 2023, 1:54 pm

TT. Your comment above is a bit too much mate. Some people on here will get to the 4th or 5th line and forget what they have just read. The usual suspects/agitators and lefties will read those lines over and over again until they finally grasp it and by the time they get to the last bit, they will be saying, 'now what was the first lines again please'.

Do them a favour and please supply a shorter version, not in Pitmans New Addition shorthand. Maybe no spaces between lines, that should do it. If you get no replies, well you will know they never got past the first 4 or 5th lines.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by jackspratt » January 27, 2023, 2:28 pm

I'm sure during the debate which will obviously ensue around The Voice, there will be many alternative opinions for and against, and by many people of various origins and backgrounds.

We should all welcome that.

And yes Sport, I did read the entire article. One thing I didn't see was any disclosure that Ms White was a One Nation candidate in the 2022 Federal election. :-k

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by trekkertony » January 27, 2023, 3:12 pm

Thanks for that Jack, on rereading the intro and seeing that it was an excandidate podcast l should have picked that up. I guess it shows that Pauline Hanson resonates with people from all walks of life.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by marjamlew » January 27, 2023, 5:08 pm

Senior Australian of the Year Professor Tom Calma issues warning on Voice to Parliament misinformation.

Professor Tom Calma gave this speech accepting the 2023 Senior Australian of the Year award:

Australians have only ever known a system where Indigenous peoples are treated as problems to be solved, not as partners and active participants in determining their destiny.

Australians have only ever known a system of consistent policy failure and poor outcomes for first nations peoples.

This year, we'll have a referendum to consider a First Nations Voice in the constitution.

Now I know a lot about a voice because I've authored and co-authored a number of publications on how it can be done.

I believe we must have enduring partnerships so that Indigenous communities can help inform policy and legal decisions that impact their lives and we can recognise the special place of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples in Australia's history.

Most recently attitudes to reconciliation showed 95 per cent of Australian voters believed it is important to have - for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples - to have a say in matters that affect us.

And 81 per cent of Australians believed it is important to protect an Indigenous body within the constitution.

As Senior Australian of the Year and a member of the Council of Elders for aged care I want to particularly address senior Australians because you are the demographic being targeted with myths and misinformation by pundits who are either ill-informed or who malicious intent regarding the Voice.

A Voice is symbolic as it includes all of our first Nations in the foundation document of our country.

It addresses the injustice of their past exclusion and provides healing for the future.

A Voice is reasonable because without a formal process to provide advice to the Parliament or government policies are too often made for First Nations peoples rather than with us.

What Australians will be asked to vote on in the referendum is the principle of whether there should be a Voice. It will be for the Parliament to determine the details of how it would work through our normal legislative and democratic processes.

Enshrinement will mean our fate will no longer be determined by the whims of politics and ever changing governments.

The Voice is not about special rights for first peoples.

All Australians will remain equal in the eyes of the law.

The two-year nation-wide co-design process proposes that the voice will not deliver programs or funding and does not have a veto power.

The Voice has no ability to hinder parliamentary processes, introduce laws or legislation nor change them and the Parliament will be under no obligation to follow the Voice's advice. Some might say we already have 11 First Nations members of Australia's Parliament but First Nations parliamentarians cannot, nor should they be expected to represent all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander voices in Australia.

They answer to all of their constituents and they are an instrument of their political parties. Surely it is obvious permanent change that is not party political - party politically driven is needed to deliver better outcomes for First Nations peoples and all Australians.

To all Australians tonight, I want to say the referendum is not a choice between improving people's lives or amending the constitution, we can do both but it will require bipartisanship, all levels of governments working together and it must involve those most affected, namely Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples.

Here in Australia we are fortunate to be the home of the oldest continuing surviving cultures in the world.

This is something we should be proud of and we should celebrate as many of us are already doing.

Let's do this together as we did in the 1967 referendum and the bridge walks for reconciliation in 2000. Walk with us, vote "yes" in the referendum.

Professor Tom Calma gave this speech accepting the 2023 Senior Australian of the Year award.

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/ ... n-warning/

A reasoned, logical and eloquent speech from the senior Australian of the Year.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Sport » January 27, 2023, 6:19 pm

marjamlew wrote:
January 27, 2023, 5:08 pm
Senior Australian of the Year Professor Tom Calma issues warning on Voice to Parliament misinformation.

Professor Tom Calma gave this speech accepting the 2023 Senior Australian of the Year award:


https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/ ... n-warning/

A reasoned, logical and eloquent speech from the senior Australian of the Year.
What a racist speech by calma, Australians and aboriginals, he separates 2 lots of people.

First nations people, trying to copy Canada, they are aboriginals.

Aboriginals and Torres Straits people, they are already in Australias history.

I hope the referendum is a complete failure.

95% of Aussies and 81% of Aussies want this, BS calma, where is that proof.

The only reason you got this award is because your Aboriginal, nothing else.

Your mob have had plenty of time to heal, get over it, whats done is done. The Germans and Japanese from the wars have got over it and its only been about 75yrs for them and a lot longer from your mob.

I dont know if your aware of this calma, but all Australians are threated equally in the eyes of the laws.

The 11 members of your mob. So if this crappy thing goes through, the voice will be just another mob of representatives somehow of trying to achieve due process of laws and policies and you say it wont, BS.

We do celebrate and remind ourselves of the horrible past of the whites and aboriginals every 26 January.

In other words his speech was all BS and nobody will object because he is black.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by noosard » June 13, 2023, 4:44 am

In a horror poll for campaigners for a Voice to parliament, new research has shown the No vote is now in the majority for the first time.

https://www.news.com.au/national/politi ... 34939557cb

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Whistler » June 13, 2023, 5:34 am

noosard wrote:
June 13, 2023, 4:44 am
In a horror poll for campaigners for a Voice to parliament, new research has shown the No vote is now in the majority for the first time.

https://www.news.com.au/national/politi ... 34939557cb
The poll was not quite that definitive, to call it a horror poll is quite misleading, accepting that the polls are moving towards a no, the overall poll showed 42% are in favour of the Voice, 40% would vote no. 18% are undecided.

To pass, a majority of states must approve and a majority overall in the country must approve. The two most populated states, NSW and Vic are very strongly in favour making the overall majority likely. Queensland and WA look like they will vote no, so it will be decided in SA and Tasmania.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Bandung_Dero » June 13, 2023, 5:58 am

I'm currently in Australia and note that some media outlets are heavily biased in their commentary and broadcast agenda. The ABC, in particular, are big advocates for the YES vote. I'm yet to see em interview or show any NO vote coverage.

Personally I don't care as I don't think it will make much difference one way or the other and until the aboriginal community can take direct responsibility for their social issues, themselves, nothing will change!
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by tamada » June 13, 2023, 8:47 am

Isn't that "until the aboriginal community be allowed to take direct responsibility for their social issues"? Less of the "they don't know what's good for them" attitude and listening to their voice instead?

Giving any minority a voice is a start but it has to be their voice and not some murmuring that's already been passed through the filter of colonialism or the recycling of old ideas and irrelevant notions.

They've had a bad start but Australia shouldn't have to repeat all the same mistakes as other nations when it comes to living in what is fundamentally someone else's country.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Whistler » June 13, 2023, 10:35 am

Lumping all aboriginals into a single bucket of drunken irresponsible ner-do-well's is the type of attitude that is fortunately dying off in Australia. Only a fool would claim that such problems do not still exist in many aboriginal communities, but it is not the case for all.

It's like Thais classifying all farangs as drunken randy old farts because there are plenty of these in the fleshpots of this country. We are not all the same.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by trekkertony » June 14, 2023, 5:01 am

I am currently on a driving holiday on the M1 starting at Tweed Heads and finishing in Victoria. What has impressed me is the signage on overpasses, bridges etc which identify the tribal lands of each area. The signage goes a long way to acknowledging the history, personal pride and attachment to the respective lands of First Nations people. Of concern is the number of First Nations people that l have spoken with who will be voting no as there is no blueprint laid out that will assist them in understanding how the mechanics of ‘The Voice’ will assist them in their everyday life.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Whistler » June 14, 2023, 6:54 am

Unless it has been renamed in the past 3 years, the M1 terminates at Tweed Heads South at Minjungbal Drive. You can be on The Pacific Hwy to head South. That Hwy bypasses almost every town from Tweed to Newcastle. Ballina, Coffs Harbour, Kempsey, Port Macquarie, Taree, Bulahdelah. Drives through Newcastle, where it is renamed the M1 again until it terminates at Wahroongah The M1 bypasses Wyong, and Gosford. The significant towns with aboriginal populations like Kempsey and Taree are all bypassed.

No matter which route you drive through Sydney, you would not pass through aboriginal suburbs.

You then travel on the Hume or Prince's Highway to Melbourne, the Hume bypasses most towns as well.

I would have driven that way dozens of times and don't reckon I would have met one single aboriginal along the way.

The other non credible part of this story is the suggestion that aboriginal people are as one and not wanting The Voice.
80% of Aboriginals are in favour of a Yes vote.

A made up story.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by trekkertony » June 14, 2023, 10:35 am

I stand corrected in relation to M1, it should have read A1. Whistler please correct your post, At no stage did l assert that the first nations people stood as one in not wanting The Voice. I stated that the aborigines that l have spoken with have grave concerns about the outcome.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Whistler » June 14, 2023, 11:34 am

trekkertony wrote:
June 14, 2023, 10:35 am
I stand corrected in relation to M1, it should have read A1. Whistler please correct your post, At no stage did l assert that the first nations people stood as one in not wanting The Voice. I stated that the aborigines that l have spoken with have grave concerns about the outcome.
Then you must be talking to the 17% who said No to the Voice as compared to the 83% in favour. I suggest the word 'grave' is a bit of hyperbole. A bit like your 'Reliable Sources' on other threads.

Properly run surveys are significantly more reliable than a guy driving down the Pacific Highway, stopping aboriginal people for a chat about their views.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... lieve-this
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by trekkertony » June 14, 2023, 2:44 pm

It appears Whistler that you have a free pass from UM admin in relation to attacking the poster and deliberately misstating the content of another posters contribution to make a point. I am still waiting for your apology for stating that that l had stated all First Nations people are against The Voice. This is not the case and was never stated nor inferred. What I said was the First Nations people l have been speaking with either do not support it as they have concerns regarding the outcome being divisive whatever the outcome.. l will not comment further until after the outcome is known.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Udon Map » June 14, 2023, 3:06 pm

trekkertony wrote:
June 14, 2023, 2:44 pm
It appears Whistler that you have a free pass from UM admin in relation to attacking the poster and deliberately misstating the content of another posters contribution to make a point. I am still waiting for your apology for stating that that l had stated all First Nations people are against The Voice. This is not the case and was never stated nor inferred. What I said was the First Nations people l have been speaking with either do not support it as they have concerns regarding the outcome being divisive whatever the outcome.. l will not comment further until after the outcome is known.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Sport » June 14, 2023, 3:51 pm

Whistler wrote:
June 14, 2023, 11:34 am

Then you must be talking to the 17% who said No to the Voice as compared to the 83% in favour. I suggest the word 'grave' is a bit of hyperbole. A bit like your 'Reliable Sources' on other threads.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... lieve-this
Dont know where you come up with the 17% not in favour whistles, if you are not in Oz or have O/Seas access to the many media outlets its roughly 50/50 and going down for the yes mob. And the majority of Aboriginals support this, rubbish from the guardian. The Aboriginals were never a nation, (that Canadian term) they were scattered around the country in small groups of probably no more than 100 in one group, you must be reading the fiction Bruce Pascoes book, dark emu.

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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by Whistler » June 14, 2023, 4:13 pm

Hi Sport,

The figure of 17% voting No, is the split for aboriginal people, not the population at large, re-read the posts and you will see that. Overall population is indeed close to 50/50.
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Re: Will ‘The Voice’ be the answer

Post by tamada » September 23, 2023, 11:42 am

If they vote no, maybe Woodside can get back to doing oil and gas exploration.
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