ClimateGate busts things wide open

World news discussion forum
Post Reply
User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » July 30, 2018, 12:51 pm

the-monk wrote:
July 30, 2018, 12:46 pm
You must be joking..... taking your stats from BP ..... LOL...
The OECD stats say that the US emissions decrease from 2014 to 2015 is a 2.2 % ( No figures for 2016-2017)...
BP graphic a Fake new, Total lie, Total BS......

From Scientific..
''
he US is involved in lots of economic activities around the world. The good part is that it is making plans to ensure the elimination of the emission of carbon dioxide. However, at the moment, its annual rate being released is around 14.34%. It may interest you to know that it used to be more than that rate as it got reduced due to some strategies put in place during the Obama administration. The moves put in place can only guarantee that the health of its citizens will not be at risk in the future.
""
The chart is a BP chart, but based on data contained here.

https://www.energyindepth.org/u-s-per-c ... tural-gas/

Image


AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

the-monk
udonmap.com
Posts: 1033
Joined: August 20, 2012, 4:56 am

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by the-monk » July 30, 2018, 1:05 pm

Thanks... BUT you failed to mention that ENERGYINDEPTH is '' a Project of the Independent Petroleum Association of America."" BP and or Petroleum association are NOT credible sources.... they are the Marketing arms of the Petroleum Industry..
Granted the US has reduced its CO2 emissions by 2%, thanks to previous administration......will this trend continue ? that s the question....

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » July 30, 2018, 1:12 pm

the-monk wrote:
July 30, 2018, 1:05 pm
Thanks... BUT you failed to mention that ENERGYINDEPTH is '' a Project of the Independent Petroleum Association of America."" BP and or Petroleum association are NOT credible sources.... they are the Marketing arms of the Petroleum Industry..
Granted the US has reduced its CO2 emissions by 2%, thanks to previous administration......will this trend continue ? that s the question....
That's why I provide sources, monk.

You are free to believe whatever you wish. If there is some data that is misreported or you don't trust the source, you are free to prove that the data is incorrect. :)

The fact that there is so much distrust when it comes to measuring things like this only proves my point that the science isn't settled, that all countries are not cooperating and reducing emissions, and there is still no definitive explanation as to how any carbon tax revenue will be spent in any measurable way to reduce the claims made regarding any global warming created by man.

Have a good one, monk.
Image
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
papafarang
udonmap.com
Posts: 4297
Joined: August 2, 2013, 10:14 am

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » July 30, 2018, 1:58 pm

Lone Star wrote:
July 30, 2018, 12:17 pm
For some, the English language is very tricky. Understanding words and their meanings is very important and necessary for comprehension.

For anyone who may misinterpret it, the CO2 chart is measuring REDUCTIONS and INCREASES in emissions for the year 2017. Those words are in bold black in the title and appear again next to the groups of countries. The chart is not measuring total output.
so the fact an American produces 2.5x what a Chinese does is irrelevant ? or the fact that the Chinese economy is growing much faster than the American economy is irrelevant too ? the point being you can't brag about reducing co2 output when your carbon footprint is so huge that even a reduction of 60% would only bring you in line with the Chinese as polluters, as I said just spreading propaganda . or don't let the truth get in the way of a good old bit of BS.
Do you not know China is the world's largest manufacturing economy and exporter of goods ?
your explanation ranks up with an alcoholic saying he had only 29 drinks last night instead of 30 so that means he's no longer an alcoholic . you really do like pointing people in the wrong direction . so quite honestly such a small drop in the numbers is pathetic at best and pointing out china is rising we all know about already.
so anyway it has to be true as it on the internet so it must be true ...lies damn lies and statistics.
well lets hope they put a bit more effort into it
Hansa village clubhouse . Tel 0981657001 https://www.google.co.th/maps/place/Han ... 5851?hl=en

User avatar
jimjay
udonmap.com
Posts: 590
Joined: July 5, 2012, 12:09 am

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by jimjay » July 30, 2018, 2:33 pm

Lone Star wrote:
July 30, 2018, 1:12 pm

That's why I provide sources, monk.
HA! This thread is replete with YEARS of you NOT posting ANY sources in most of your "conversations with yourself" in this thread. :badteeth: :badteeth: :badteeth: :badteeth:

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » July 31, 2018, 4:20 pm

It's possible that those who struggle with definitions and comprehension may also struggle with basic statistical analysis.

First, since BP is a British multinational oil and gas company headquartered in London, England. I fail to understand how they could be so biased in favor of the US to post false information.

Second, companies that provide false information are subject to civil and criminal liability, not to mention ethical violations that harm their credibility. If anyone chooses not to believe the BP chart, then don't believe. I don't care, unless you choose to provide proof that the chart and the accompanying data are wrong.

Third, the chart only shows each country's progress at reducing or increasing co2 levels over a 1-year period. It makes no claim regarding total pollution levels, total co2 output, population sizes or anything else. It only provides a view of the progress in cleaning up or the lack thereof.

Fourth, it's easy to ask questions to try to win an argument that isn't being made. Answering those questions would have nothing to do with what the chart or accompanying data is providing. I would advise the questioner to look up his/her own answers to those questions.

Anyone who chooses to believe that BP is lying, wrong, misused data and/or is biased against the rest of the world and in favor of the US is free to believe whatever they wish. I don't care. It's not my data. I didn't make up numbers (as some others have done regarding war casualties, economics, war history, etc. in the past).

Lastly, I'm not going to attempt to besmirch anyone personally for not agreeing with the chart. Up to you.

Here's wishing all a happy and safe week.

Image
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » August 2, 2018, 9:03 am

The US Environmental Protection Agency released the agency's annual air quality report on Tuesday. It showed that pollution levels in many areas have been dramatically reduced -- even while the economy is booming.

Andrew Wheeler, the acting administrator, held a press conference on Tuesday to coincide with the release of the report.
“This report details a remarkable achievement that should be recognized, celebrated, and replicated around the world. A 73% reduction in any other social ill, such as crime, disease, or drug addiction, would lead the evening news.”
The EPA report shows that between 1970 and 2017, the combined emissions of six harmful pollutants have declined by more than 70%. During that same time period, the US economy grew three times larger.

Wheeler futher stated in his press conference:
“When President Trump called me four weeks ago to assume the duties of acting administrator, he asked me to continue to clean up the air, clean up the water, and continue deregulation to spur economic growth. The president knows we can do all three, we at EPA know that we can do all three, and the data from our release today shows that we can do all three.”
In the EPA report, it shows that large reductions were accomplished in the areas of sulfur dioxide (88%), lead (80%), carbon monoxide (77%), nitrogen dioxide (56%), fine particulate matter and ground-level ozone.

I guess where the US is concerned, it has reflected a reduction in many things bad and increases in many things good.
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » August 11, 2018, 9:10 am

Out of Winnipeg ... Climate Barbie is back in the news in Canada. 55555

The embattled Environment Minister has finally admitted that the carbon tax will hurt jobs and drive them out of Canada and probably across the border.

McKenna's department posted a document online recently that pledged an exemption of the carbon tax on industries for 80-90% of their greenhouse gas emissions. Why have exemptions if this is so important? Canada doesn't want to lose jobs to countries that don't have carbon taxes.

However, all along McKenna has stated that the carbon tax would HELP Canada's economy.

BUT ...

Climate Barbie isn't exempting consumers who will have to pay the carbon tax on 100% of their heat, gas and other fuels. So they don't care that much about a hard-working Canadian. To make matters worse, the Canadian government is yet to tell Canadians what they're going to have to pay.

Economists in Canada are predicting a ballpark figure of about $1,000 a year per household.

And we still don't know HOW that money will be spent or the MEASURABLE results of that spending.

Nah, it's not about money. 55555
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » August 27, 2018, 2:56 pm

Now Merkel doesn't want the Paris Climate Treaty enforced.

Over a year ago in June, Merkel and Macron proclaimed that the “the Paris Climate Treaty is irreversible and cannot be renegotiated.”

Trump knew it was crap and that it wasn't good for the US. That's why he got the US out.

A month later, Merkel bails on the primary treaty demands. By January 2018, she withdraws completely from the target emissions goal set for 2020.

MMCC is about money.

Reuters reports that Merkel believes swifter cuts to carbon emissions are counterproductive because they can't meet the lesser goals they set for themselves.

It's all about money, and the fact that the US isn't playing.
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
Udon Map
Admin
Posts: 2832
Joined: July 31, 2013, 7:57 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Udon Map » August 27, 2018, 10:54 pm

Lone Star wrote:
August 27, 2018, 2:56 pm
Now Merkel doesn't want the Paris Climate Treaty enforced.

Over a year ago in June, Merkel and Macron proclaimed that the “the Paris Climate Treaty is irreversible and cannot be renegotiated.”

Trump knew it was crap and that it wasn't good for the US. That's why he got the US out.

A month later, Merkel bails on the primary treaty demands. By January 2018, she withdraws completely from the target emissions goal set for 2020.

MMCC is about money.

Reuters reports that Merkel believes swifter cuts to carbon emissions are counterproductive because they can't meet the lesser goals they set for themselves.

It's all about money, and the fact that the US isn't playing.
I expected better from you, LS. But at least now I understand where you're coming from. The wording of this post is very close, way too close to be coincidence, to The Last Refuge/Conservative Tree House/Mark Bradman. Talk about a guy with an agenda. :roll:

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » August 28, 2018, 4:36 am

Don't know any Bradman.

Besides Reuters, you can find the same reporting of Merkel's balks on Politico, Bloomberg, EcoWatch, NewClimate.org and others.

Apparently, Germany is viewing it all as a greater leap than anticipated.
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
Udon Map
Admin
Posts: 2832
Joined: July 31, 2013, 7:57 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Udon Map » August 28, 2018, 8:10 am

Lone Star wrote:
August 28, 2018, 4:36 am
Don't know any Bradman.

Besides Reuters, you can find the same reporting of Merkel's balks on Politico, Bloomberg, EcoWatch, NewClimate.org and others.

Apparently, Germany is viewing it all as a greater leap than anticipated.
But not denying the Last Refuge/Conservative Tree House connection. Feel free to continue this conversation without me, LS. I'm out.

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 6, 2018, 7:06 am

Looks like Trump was correct again.

This time? The Paris Climate Agreement that Trump relieved the US from having to participate.

It's slowly unraveling due to the fact that it has always been a non-binding agreement, and the latest stage is all occurring right here in our own back yard of BKK. The UN is here making more speeches about saving the planet. In December, the hand-wringing will move to a meeting in Poland.

As reported by the South China Morning Post:
Time is running out to save the Paris Agreement, United Nations climate experts warned Tuesday at a key Bangkok meeting, as rich nations were accused of shirking their responsibility for environmental damage.
Yeah, we knew this. The West would be hammered for bucks by climate justice warriors, and the West refuses to be shaken down -- especially when some participants have no intention of reducing their emissions.

Coal is surging in use in countries like China and India, and they're not about to stifle their economies by restricting the use of coal. Russia is expanding their use of coal.

Brazil is talking about pulling out of the agreement.

The whole of idea of making MMCC something that has to be funded with more taxes on individuals and the wealthiest countries imposed upon to make it all better with money taken from its citizens has scam written all over it. The scam is that no one can say on what or how the money will be spent; and MOST importantly, what measurable results will be seen after the spending of billions of dollars. Scam.
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
papafarang
udonmap.com
Posts: 4297
Joined: August 2, 2013, 10:14 am

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » September 6, 2018, 8:13 am

Looks like Trump was correct again. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Coal is surging in use in countries like China and India, and they're not about to stifle their economies by restricting the use of coal. Russia is expanding their use of coal.

How laughable , trump correct again ..on what :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: .
china , their output is HUGE as the population is HUGE.
china ,india 36.28% of total world population, add in Russia and your probably hitting 40% ,then you compare it with the usa is 4.28% of the total world population, of course they use more :roll: . Trumps pulls out is pure financial greed , nothing to do with it is or isn't true, like saying Exxon Mobil don't believe in climate change either :lol: :lol:
so I will explain it AGAIN with a simple chart , that a 5th grader would understand.
Image
Hansa village clubhouse . Tel 0981657001 https://www.google.co.th/maps/place/Han ... 5851?hl=en

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 6, 2018, 9:02 am

papafarang wrote:
September 6, 2018, 8:13 am
How laughable , trump correct again ..on what :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: .
Getting out because it was designed as a scam on Western countries.
china , their output is HUGE as the population is HUGE.
china ,india 36.28% of total world population, add in Russia and your probably hitting 40% ,then you compare it with the usa is 4.28% of the total world population, of course they use more :roll: .
You're always trying to win an argument that isn't being made.

I wasn't comparing anyone's use of coal to anyone else. Go back and read it again.

The increased use of coal is causing countries to not be able to meet the carbon emissions goals (even though the US has met and exceeded their goals). Countries like China and India and Russia that ramp up coal usage affects the total atmospheric environment. If there are no reductions, the Paris Climate Agreement is spinning its wheels. Wasted time. Wasted money.
Trumps pulls out is pure financial greed , nothing to do with it is or isn't true, like saying Exxon Mobil don't believe in climate change either :lol: :lol:
It's Trump being responsible with tax revenue of American citizens. If you equate someone avoiding a bad deal that screws them over as being greedy, you need some definition remediation. I guess by your definition, every other country that is backing off from participation in this flawed document is also greedy? :D

America First. The money is better spent on other things than a climate agreement that was doomed to failure. Non-binding agreement. No one has to follow any guidelines. No one has to explain where the money will be spent. No one has to explain any measurable results from the spending of billions of dollars. Yeah, that'll work. 555 Scam.
so I will explain it AGAIN with a simple chart , that a 5th grader would understand.
A 5th grader may or may not understand that the chart has nothing to do with the failure of Paris Climate Agreement. However, many more 5th graders also try to win arguments that aren't being made with charts that have nothing to do with the point being made -- the agreement is flawed and non-binding. :D
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
papafarang
udonmap.com
Posts: 4297
Joined: August 2, 2013, 10:14 am

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » September 6, 2018, 9:37 am

And Trump knows what about climate change ? :lol: no he just pulled out because he wans to keep the edge . carbon footprint is about all of us, every individual but you wish to keep it to apples and oranges. look again at the numbers...or just keep waffling on , up too you
Image
Hansa village clubhouse . Tel 0981657001 https://www.google.co.th/maps/place/Han ... 5851?hl=en

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 6, 2018, 9:42 am

papafarang wrote:
September 6, 2018, 8:13 am
How laughable , trump correct again ..on what :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: .
Getting out because it was designed as a scam on Western countries.
china , their output is HUGE as the population is HUGE.
china ,india 36.28% of total world population, add in Russia and your probably hitting 40% ,then you compare it with the usa is 4.28% of the total world population, of course they use more :roll: .
You're always trying to win an argument that isn't being made.

I wasn't comparing anyone's use of coal to anyone else. Go back and read it again.

The increased use of coal is causing countries to not be able to meet the carbon emissions goals (even though the US has met and exceeded their goals). Countries like China and India and Russia that ramp up coal usage affects the total atmospheric environment. If there are no reductions, the Paris Climate Agreement is spinning its wheels. Wasted time. Wasted money.
Trumps pulls out is pure financial greed , nothing to do with it is or isn't true, like saying Exxon Mobil don't believe in climate change either :lol: :lol:
It's Trump being responsible with tax revenue of American citizens. If you equate someone avoiding a bad deal that screws them over as being greedy, you need some definition remediation. I guess by your definition, every other country that is backing off from participation in this flawed document is also greedy? :D

America First. The money is better spent on other things than a climate agreement that was doomed to failure. Non-binding agreement. No one has to follow any guidelines. No one has to explain where the money will be spent. No one has to explain any measurable results from the spending of billions of dollars. Yeah, that'll work. 555 Scam.
so I will explain it AGAIN with a simple chart , that a 5th grader would understand.
A 5th grader may or may not understand that the chart has nothing to do with the failure of Paris Climate Agreement. However, many more 5th graders also try to win arguments that aren't being made with charts that have nothing to do with the point being made -- the agreement is flawed and non-binding. :D
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
papafarang
udonmap.com
Posts: 4297
Joined: August 2, 2013, 10:14 am

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by papafarang » September 6, 2018, 10:31 am

again it's about greed , and yes non binding . if tomorrow the scientist said with 100% certainty that the world will be a nasty place to live in the future , there will be floods, droughts, storms famine and pestilence , Trump wouldn't give a MONKEYS NUTS ABOUT IT.

'A 5th grader may or may not understand that the chart has nothing to do with the failure of Paris Climate Agreement. However, many more 5th graders also try to win arguments that aren't being made with charts that have nothing to do with the point being made -- the agreement is flawed and non-binding'

oh so this thread is not about climate change then. it's about Trump ? no I follow the thread ,not whatever tangent 'whataboutism' you want to take it on , yes non binding, flawed is just your opinion
but your the one pointing out india and china ,whats that got to do with America pulling out ? you can't have this discussion both ways ...oh it's non binding ..but but whatabout china :lol:.

'It's Trump being responsible with tax revenue of American citizens'
:lol: now that is laughable, you ramble on about it's a conspiracy to collect carbon tax , but not a peep about the recent huge taxes piled onto American businesses by Trump :lol:

Imagepic host free
Hansa village clubhouse . Tel 0981657001 https://www.google.co.th/maps/place/Han ... 5851?hl=en

User avatar
Lone Star
udonmap.com
Posts: 5698
Joined: June 26, 2014, 11:52 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 6, 2018, 10:46 am

papafarang wrote:
September 6, 2018, 10:31 am
oh so this thread is not about climate change then. it's about Trump ? no I follow the thread ,not whatever tangent 'whataboutism' you want to take it on , yes non binding, flawed is just your opinion
but your the one pointing out india and china ,whats that got to do with America pulling out ? you can't have this discussion both ways ...oh it's non binding ..but but whatabout china :lol:.
You miss the point yet again. You're arguing something that was not claimed in my post.

These things continue to happen AFTER the US left the agreement. My post was about the agreement continuing to collapse because India and China and Russia are ramping up coal use and not meeting their carbon emission targets - AND - other Western countries not wanting to cough up money to "developing countries" like India and China who aren't meeting targets.

Those two issues were just some of MANY of Trump's concerns and why the US is OUT of it. That's the connection.
now that is laughable, you ramble on about it's a conspiracy to collect carbon tax , but not a peep about the recent huge taxes piled onto American businesses by Trump
What "huge taxes piled onto American businesses by Trump"? You are seriously mistaken.

First of all, presidents don't create taxes. Congress creates taxes.

Secondly, the tax cuts proposed by Trump and passed by Congress REDUCED the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21%. Regulations were also massively cut to give businesses room to grow without long, drawn-out government delays to decisions and also allows them to write off many businesses expenses that were not allowed before. Those are just some reasons why the US economy is on fire.

Read up. :D

If you want to talk about your chart, then talk about it; but it has nothing to do with my post.
AMERICA: One of the Greatest Stories Ever Told.

User avatar
Udon Map
Admin
Posts: 2832
Joined: July 31, 2013, 7:57 pm

Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Udon Map » September 6, 2018, 11:17 am

Lone Star wrote:
September 6, 2018, 10:46 am
What "huge taxes piled onto American businesses by Trump"?
I'm just guessing (I haven't spoken with papafarang), but perhaps he's talking about the "tax" (in the generic sense) on businesses resulting from the tariff war. Not saying that it's wrong to impose tariffs on the goods of other countries to the extent that they impose tariffs on U.S. goods, but such a policy is not without consequences.

Post Reply

Return to “World News”