Could you be British?

Post by **old-timer** » January 21, 2015, 2:56 pm

Earnest wrote:how would you specify being English?
k

To be English you have to be born in England, if you have a UK passport and was not born in England you are British but not English.
Same thing for the Scottish, Irish and welsh, people born in Scotland, Ireland or Wales are of that nationality and British. And Mr Patel is Indian because he was born there, and he has a UK passport which makes him British but not English, however his children are English because they were born in England.

OT........... $\:D/$

Post by **pomps** » January 21, 2015, 3:08 pm

Marvellous what you can find on the net $\:D/$

Post by **marjamlew** » January 21, 2015, 3:38 pm

socksy wrote:
marjamlew wrote:
stattointhailand wrote:You can define being British but how would you specify being English?

How about anyone who can trace their ancestry back to 937 in the lands that became the Kingdom of England

I'm back to 1420 so far and still working on it ......... but I'll be English one day
I don't know that defining/specifying what a Pom is is that hard Statts - Short, anaemic, bald or balding, bad teeth, scared of the soap, can't bat. can't bowl, loves a winge....... hahahaha and that's only the birds mate

And had I not been lucky I may have been British but thank Buddha I'm not - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CArn_f5POS4
And here is the Aussie 2015 version marjamlew - contains strong language.

I'll get my coat.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/QmhQct1i2Rw

Love it Socksy - Funniest thing I have seen in a long time.
I once taught that song ( I am Australian) to a class but we had to change it to Macedonian and play with the lyrics, much as the Mussie wags did, to reflect the majority of class members - I am, you are, we are Macedonian (not Greek) hahahahaha. And a bit more British - Colonial, Australian humour with a Muslim flavour:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3-9_vVe2iw

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 4:18 pm

marjamlew wrote:
Love it Socksy - Funniest thing I have seen in a long time.
I once taught that song ( I am Australian) to a class but we had to change it to Macedonian and play with the lyrics, much as the Mussie wags did, to reflect the majority of class members - I am, you are, we are Macedonian (not Greek) hahahahaha.

I had a slightly different reaction, lew.

To me, it was xenophobic, racist nonsense.

Post by **Aardvark** » January 21, 2015, 5:35 pm

Xenophobic, Racist ... words invented to stifle freedom of thought ....

Post by **bignote1** » January 21, 2015, 5:54 pm

jackspratt wrote:
I had a slightly different reaction, lew.

To me, it was xenophobic, racist nonsense.

I agree and I think you could add mindless to the list.

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 6:02 pm

bignote1 wrote:
jackspratt wrote:
I had a slightly different reaction, lew.

To me, it was xenophobic, racist nonsense.
I agree and I think you could add mindless to the list.

While not disagreeing with you, big ....... it ain't mindless.

There has been a fair bit of ......... well let's say xenophobic and racist........ thought gone into the production.

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 6:08 pm

Aardvark wrote:Xenophobic, Racist ... words invented to stifle freedom of thought ....

Definition of xenophobia in English:
noun
[mass noun]
Dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries:

Definition of racist in English:
noun
A person who believes that a particular race is superior to another:

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/

The definitions seem pretty clear - can't see anything about stifling thought.

But it is a great line for those who believe they have a right to express/publish uncontested racist and xenophobic ideas.

Post by **bignote1** » January 21, 2015, 6:37 pm

old-timer wrote:
Earnest wrote:how would you specify being English?
k
To be English you have to be born in England, if you have a UK passport and was not born in England you are British but not English.
Same thing for the Scottish, Irish and welsh, people born in Scotland, Ireland or Wales are of that nationality and British. And Mr Patel is Indian because he was born there, and he has a UK passport which makes him British but not English, however his children are English because they were born in England.

OT........... $\:D/$

To get back on topic;-
OT I think you are technically correct but being British or English goes beyond passport.
Your passport (name, date of birth etc.) defines who you are but not what you are.
To use your example of Mr Patel. If he arrived in the UK when he was 25 yrs old all his formative years would have been spent in India so although he is technically British (if he has the passport) in my eyes he would not be British he would be Anglo-Indian. Before anyone berates me.....I do not mean this in a derogatory way. If he comes to the UK and commits himself to Great Britain I would be the first to welcome hin and shake his hand.
If he has not grown up with the knowledge of our history, Bertie Wooster, Captain Robert Falcon Scott, Billy Bunter, Group Captain Douglas Bader, Dixon of Dock Green, The Changing of the Guard, John Mills, Kenneth Moore, Bobby Charlton, The Beatles, Gareth Edwards, PMQ's ,Dunkirk etc. etc. etc. in my eyes he will never be British, but of course I would respect him.
Imo our history is the glue that makes us British.

Post by **Bonanza** » January 21, 2015, 7:15 pm

The UK Government seems to define being British as passing the 'Life in UK' test. This is the requirement (along with a basic spoken English) for obtaining British Citizenship. You might like to try one of the many 'Life in UK' practice test sites and then see if you qualify as British.

Most people fail.

Example questions:

1. On which day is Vaisakhi Festival held?
a. 14 April
b. 14 May
c. !5 June.

2. What was the estimated population of the British Empire during the Victorian period?
a. 325 Million
b 600 Million
c. 400 Million

3. At what age can you be required to act on Jury duty?
a. Between 21 and 65 years old
b. Between 21 and 70 years old
c. Between 18 and 70 years old

The above are genuine questions - did you know the answers or make educated guesses? Try the websites for fun.

Post by **Khun Paul** » January 21, 2015, 7:23 pm

If I had to pass the test, I would fail but then none of those were ever asked and I was exempt jury duty anyway, apart from a Coroners Jury. To me none of those with the exception of Jury Duty to my mind would show me someone knows a damn thing about being British.
But then I'm a racist white sonofabitch so they tell me ( which I am not by the way) plus I am English to boot.

Post by **Aardvark** » January 21, 2015, 7:32 pm

jackspratt wrote:
Aardvark wrote:Xenophobic, Racist ... words invented to stifle freedom of thought ....

Definition of xenophobia in English:
noun
[mass noun]
Dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries:

Definition of racist in English:
noun
A person who believes that a particular race is superior to another:
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/

The definitions seem pretty clear - can't see anything about stifling thought.

But it is a great line for those who believe they have a right to express/publish uncontested racist and xenophobic ideas.

Umm, you mean Freedom Of Speech

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 7:33 pm

Khun Paul wrote: But then I'm a racist white sonofabitch so they tell me ............

Just out of interest, KP - who is "they"?

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 7:36 pm

Aardvark wrote:
jackspratt wrote:
Aardvark wrote:Xenophobic, Racist ... words invented to stifle freedom of thought ....

Definition of xenophobia in English:
noun
[mass noun]
Dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries:

Definition of racist in English:
noun
A person who believes that a particular race is superior to another:
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/

The definitions seem pretty clear - can't see anything about stifling thought.

But it is a great line for those who believe they have a right to express/publish uncontested racist and xenophobic ideas.
Umm, you mean Freedom Of Speech

Errr!..... no.

Did you overlook the "uncontested" bit Aardy?

Post by **old-timer** » January 21, 2015, 7:42 pm

jackspratt wrote:
Khun Paul wrote: But then I'm a racist white sonofabitch so they tell me ............
Just out of interest, KP - who is "they"?

Please don't ask for evidence when he says you jackspratt are "they".

OT............................ $\:D/$

Post by **marjamlew** » January 21, 2015, 7:48 pm

jackspratt wrote:
marjamlew wrote:
Love it Socksy - Funniest thing I have seen in a long time.
I once taught that song ( I am Australian) to a class but we had to change it to Macedonian and play with the lyrics, much as the Mussie wags did, to reflect the majority of class members - I am, you are, we are Macedonian (not Greek) hahahahaha.
I had a slightly different reaction, lew.

To me, it was xenophobic, racist nonsense.

I love a bit of mindless comedy that pokes fun at stereotypes, takes the pish and doesn't acknowledge boundaries (charlie hebdo?). It's like Fat Pizza, Housos and Bogan Hunters and we've agreed to disagree on those before Jack . I don't see it as racist when it's taking the pish out of all races, religions and cultures and all race and culture based stereotypes. I laughed and laughed....What do you call three Lebs in the sauna? Gorillas in the mist..... Laughed and Laughed.... That's funny Jack........
The ability to be able to laugh at ourselves and everyone else is one of the many positives that we have inherited from our British forbears.

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 7:49 pm

old-timer wrote:
jackspratt wrote:
Khun Paul wrote: But then I'm a racist white sonofabitch so they tell me ............
Just out of interest, KP - who is "they"?
Please don't ask for evidence when he says you jackspratt are "they".

OT............................ $\:D/$

Please don't verbal me, O/T.

Whilst I have had mixed thoughts about KP over many years, the above expression has not been one of them.

Hence ....... I am still interested to know - who is "they"?

Post by **jackspratt** » January 21, 2015, 7:53 pm

marjamlew wrote:
I love a bit of mindless comedy that pokes fun at stereotypes, .........

lew, if I thought they were poking fun at stereotypes, I would have laughed along with you.

To the contrary, it is pretty clear (to me at least) they are reinforcing and perpetuating those same stereotypes.

I suggest you watch it again.

Post by **Earnest** » January 22, 2015, 2:55 am

old-timer wrote:To be English you have to be born in England, if you have a UK passport and was not born in England you are British but not English.
Same thing for the Scottish, Irish and welsh, people born in Scotland, Ireland or Wales are of that nationality and British. And Mr Patel is Indian because he was born there, and he has a UK passport which makes him British but not English, however his children are English because they were born in England.

What about if you were born on a ship in international waters and your parents were English, the captain was English and the ship was registered in Southampton - would you be English or British?

Post by **bignote1** » January 22, 2015, 3:20 am

Earnest wrote:
old-timer wrote:To be English you have to be born in England, if you have a UK passport and was not born in England you are British but not English.
Same thing for the Scottish, Irish and welsh, people born in Scotland, Ireland or Wales are of that nationality and British. And Mr Patel is Indian because he was born there, and he has a UK passport which makes him British but not English, however his children are English because they were born in England.
What about if you were born on a ship in international waters and your parents were English, the captain was English and the ship was registered in Southampton - would you be English or British?

If the boat was registered in Southampton, Suffolk County, New York State, USA, most probably American, however if registered on the Shinnecock Reservation, Southampton, NYS, maybe Red Indian.
Short answer is both, they are not mutually exclusive.