Crypto-currencies: The future is now

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GT93
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by GT93 » March 7, 2014, 12:07 am

What's Mt Gox mean? Many more cyber criminals are trying to steal the funny money? I would expect some of them will succeed. More inconveniences to come. I imagine Mark Karpeles has more to worry about than bankruptcy. Some serious criminals might have lost their funny money thanks to him.


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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by leterry60614 » March 22, 2014, 10:57 pm

http://t.co/gpAJklgL90

Bail-in train is coming in Ukraine. IMF-like proposal for bank deposit haircuts as happened in Cyprus... Bitcoin users not affected!

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by KHONDAHM » April 13, 2014, 2:57 am

Lots of events have transpired in the crypto-currency world which collectively drove the price of BTC down to under $400 recently. Still, innovation, adoption, investment, and acceptance continues to progress as if nothing has changed. To wit, the BTC and LTC ATM machine installed in the US House of Representatives offices:

http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-atms-ca ... ill-debut/

Big money and smart money continues to invest in the startups and technologies which promise to change everything. Crypto-currencies are still in the nascent stages. Like where email was in the mid-1990's.

The current popular thought is it will first replace services like Western Union, PayPal, and others. Once those are gone and transacting in crypto-currencies becomes ubiquitous, it should then be able to overcome the legal barriers currently being developed and imposed by various governments. Those governments are attacking the points at which crypto-currencies are converted to/from fiat currencies because they can control and influence the underlying fiat financial systems. In a future where transacting solely in crypto-currencies is the norm, there will be no need to convert to/from fiat and what is restrictive legal policy today will be rendered irrelevant.

What is happening today is the equivalent of "if governments intervened to restrict the use of email". Pause and imagine for a moment that governments decided to restrict the use of email today and force is all to return to licking stamps and dropping all correspondance in mailboxes again. Silly, right? Well, that is exactly what they are attempting with crypto-currencies. The genie is out of the bottle and they are desperately trying to put it back in via ultimately futile declarations and legislation.

The saga continues...

BTC at $420 as I type this.
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by KHONDAHM » April 13, 2014, 3:09 am

"Bitcoin’s success should be measured not by the current value or exchange rate vis-a-vis the dollar or others, but rather by the growth in the real economy. That means businesses being able to transact easily in bitcoins, people being able to execute everyday transactions, institutions accepting it as a valid form of exchange, and so on."

http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-fated-boom-bust/

A pessimistic, but well researched point of view with many salient historical points.

Still, provided what is quoted progresses, crypto-currencies will progress.
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by leterry60614 » April 13, 2014, 5:30 pm

Bitcoin caught the attention of the IRS and that in itself is a measure of success!

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by parrot » April 13, 2014, 7:21 pm

Western Union is a dinosaur....as are travelers' checks.....but they live on, especially for people who have used them in the past. And today, a comment in a Bangkok Post article about the difficulty of using Japanese ATMs with Thai cards (or most foreign cards). I can see how a crypto currency might catch on to tackle those sorts of problems.
I remember how amazed I was the first time I put my Texas-based credit union debit card into an ATM in England....sometime late 80's.....and withdrew money from my account.......as the ATM was on a military base, I could choose dollars or pounds. Maybe a crypto currency will have it's big payday........but I'd guess it'll be past my life time. Too many governments involved in currency control.....and, biggest detractor at the time to me......I'm not enamored with the idea that the money in my pocket might be worth 40% less in a few days (or even 40% more) because of something that is completely off the horizon. I leave that up to my investments where I can throttle up or down my risk as I deem necessary. That doesn't appear to be possible with crypto currencies, at least at the moment.

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by Laan Yaa Mo » April 13, 2014, 10:14 pm

I still use traveler's cheques because I get a higher rate than any other means of exchange with Canadian money in Thailand.
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by JimboPSM » April 16, 2014, 1:34 am

leterry60614 wrote:Bitcoin caught the attention of the IRS and that in itself is a measure of success!
The IRS are viewing Bitcoins as property rather than as a currency, so the taxation implications will be related to capital gains or, as some may have found, losses :shock:

From Bloomberg:
Bitcoin Is Property, Not Currency, in Tax System: IRS
By Richard Rubin and Carter Dougherty Mar 25, 2014

The U.S. government will treat Bitcoin as property for tax purposes, applying rules it uses to govern stocks and barter transactions, the Internal Revenue Service said in its first substantive ruling on the issue.

Today’s IRS guidance will provide certainty for Bitcoin investors, along with income-tax liability that wasn’t specified before. Purchasing a $2 cup of coffee with Bitcoins bought for $1 would trigger $1 in capital gains for the coffee drinker and $2 of gross income for the coffee shop.

The IRS, faced with a choice of treating Bitcoins like currency or property, chose property. That decision could reduce the volume of transactions conducted with the virtual currency, said Pamir Gelenbe, a venture partner at Hummingbird Ventures, which invests in technology businesses.

“It’s challenging if you have to think about capital gains before you buy a cup of coffee,” he said.

Full article: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-2 ... -says.html
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by Stantheman » April 16, 2014, 2:08 am

With the way the IRS works, and with their policy on paper reduction, the filer who claims Bitcoins will only need to fill out 4 to 6 additional forms.

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by leterry60614 » April 16, 2014, 10:52 am

Yes, there are quite a few forms to fill out this year for บิตคอยน์ . However, my guess is very few will next year as most we'll hide underground... The IRS hasn't learn its lesson from the Eurodollar debacle and are repeating the same mistakes.

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by KHONDAHM » April 16, 2014, 7:42 pm

parrot wrote:Western Union is a dinosaur....as are travelers' checks.....but they live on...
I opine that generational preference has a lot to do with that. As the current 20-something's become the 40-something's, those payment options will go the way of the VHS tapes and the phonograph. Case in point: what are the ages of those still using traveler's checks? I doubt most 20-something's know how to get them - nevermind how to use them. The generation after them will likely think the same about ATM cards...

During my lifetime, I will likely never touch the crypto-currency I have obtained, but I am hopeful my kids will profit from my foresight someday.
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by parrot » April 16, 2014, 8:54 pm

KHONDAHM wrote:During my lifetime, I will likely never touch the crypto-currency I have obtained, but I am hopeful my kids will profit from my foresight someday.
I think, in the end, this is where I can't get my hands around the idea. I view currencies as something I use to buy things, something I can calculate my net-worth, something I can exchange for services....but not something I use as for profit making (or loss). If I plan on buying a new car advertised for $40,000....and if the dealer/maker says I'll take US currency or bitcoins, what happens if the $40,000 worth of bitcoins in my possession that I plan to offer next week suddenly are now only worth $32,000?
Is anyone using the ATMs/machines that supposedly accept bitcoin purchases? Are people who obtained bitcoins when the value was $1000 using them now that the value is quite a bit less.........or are people who obtained bitcoins when the value was less than today using them because the value is greater today?
My questions are genuine....I'm really trying to understand the concept of cryptocurrencies (such as bitcoin) as a currency, not a gamble. If anyone has a link that explains in layman's terms how this works, please post it.

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by GT93 » April 17, 2014, 2:58 pm

I understand that they're fairly easy to steal by sophisticated hackers. Holders of bitcoins are dependent on others who they have never met from preventing this happening. It has happened before. I would expect KD's crytpo-currency to have been nicked inside the next 10 years. Wait until the North Koreans get into this game. There are other people to worry about as well such as bored unemployed say European youth.
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by merchant seaman » April 17, 2014, 3:14 pm

Didn't take long for the IRS to get involved. Every purchase made with bitcoins must be reported and taxed accordingly. What a headache that would cause.
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Post by KHONDAHM » May 4, 2014, 2:31 am

GT93 wrote:I understand that they're fairly easy to steal by sophisticated hackers. Holders of bitcoins are dependent on others who they have never met from preventing this happening. It has happened before. I would expect KD's crytpo-currency to have been nicked inside the next 10 years. Wait until the North Koreans get into this game. There are other people to worry about as well such as bored unemployed say European youth.
You may not be fully informed. Those getting hacked either

1. Entrust their coins to some company mistakenly thinking that nascent company is hack-proof
2. Store their coin wallet on a machine used to connect to the internet
3. Do not encrypt their wallet or use hack-able passwords

KD's coin wallets are stored on encrypted USB drives and physical paper. A very good thief may steal an encrypted drive, but good luck hacking it. The password is a phrase and includes punctuation, numbers, and mixed case letters. The thief may steal the paper, but the wallet ID on any one sheet is not whole and they would have to know how to make it whole. Good luck with that.

If you care to convert your expectation to a firm bet, I will cover your bet. :)
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by GT93 » May 4, 2014, 4:07 am

No thank you. I don't follow this closely enough. I was under the impression that all Bit Coins are dependent on a third party's security and that hackers or whatever the correct word is can circumvent your personal security by taking on the third party.
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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by marklv » May 11, 2014, 9:50 pm

I wonder if there is sufficient interest in a bitcoin and/or altcoin meetup in the Udon area, to organize one. There are several per week in Bangkok, and I go to some of those when I can. I personally would be willing to travel from Udon as far as far south as Khon Kaen or as far north as Nong Khai for a meetup. Last time I checked Meetup.com has nothing in this area.

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by marklv » May 29, 2014, 7:37 pm

There is a meetup with two members. (Check www.meetup.com) Until more people join, I'll have to be content with attending meetups when I'm in Bangkok.

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by leterry60614 » May 31, 2014, 1:21 pm

The U.S. is seeking more than $10 billion penalty from bank BNP. Can you think of a bigger incentive for foreign banks to use bitcoins?

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Crypto-currencies: The future is now

Post by parrot » May 31, 2014, 2:08 pm

leterry60614 wrote:The U.S. is seeking more than $10 billion penalty from bank BNP. Can you think of a bigger incentive for foreign banks to use bitcoins?

Actually, I can see why governments, especially the US, would be concerned about banks using bitcoins. A lack of a paper trail might appeal to some....to many....but in the big scheme of things, I can't see governments giving up their ability to track the flow of money. If anything, the US is more concerned than ever about where its citizens park their money.......http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2014/05/19/cre ... crackdown/

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