Israel...so, who knew?

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BKKSTAN
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Post by BKKSTAN » August 14, 2006, 8:30 am

Artfully dodged,Papy!I assume Val is clapping for you.If you only want comments by a particular member,why don't you PM them?



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Post by Papy Ion » August 14, 2006, 9:07 am

BKKSTAN wrote:Artfully dodged,Papy!I assume Val is clapping for you.If you only want comments by a particular member,why don't you PM them?
Only because I did not think it was necessary (I have been waited to let Jingjai enough time and the opportunity to react to my first post about the clarification that I requested), but I will probably send him a private message soon if needed.

Anyway, I did not dodge anything. You just have to read correctly the other thread and you will see who really dodges when asked about proven facts... You intervene when not asked, but still have difficulties to answer honestly on certain matters. Ma๏ pen ra๏. This is not the subject here! It is not enough that I let you have the last word in the other thread, you are using my legitimate request to restart a discussion about a topic where my point has already been made and where I have already explained that I would not participate anymore... So, don't feel the need to answer here or elsewhere about this subject as I will ignore your reply unless you demonstrate that you are able to read and understand correctly what others write.

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Post by arjay » August 14, 2006, 10:54 am

Do you think we could possibly drop this subject now.

I believe The Forum is intended to be for the sharing of ideas and information, for the research of information and Ok maybe some debating of the odd contentious issue; and I do realise that some members like vigorous and healthy debates, but it is important to avoid these becoming personal or unduly pursuing/harassing members.

We want members to feel free and comfortable to freely participate in the Forum, rather than to feel they are going to be pursued if they say something that may turn out to be inappropriate.

If I may quote:

beer monkey wrote:
i think this was just a copy and paste of something that's doing the rounds on the Net.
jingjai wrote:
Yes, you are right, I recieved it as a forwarded e-mail. How much of it is true, I don't know. I thought that even if 50% of it was true, it was worth a post. I think quite a bit of it is true though.
I don't think JJ is an active daily poster. Though he has made posts since Papy's earlier requests for an apology/explanation. JJ has responded as above and I would suggest that's as much as an admission from him as you're going to get. I guess with the benefit of hindsight he realises that maybe it wasn't the most responsible piece of "reporting"(?). Can't we leave it that, and move on, please?

We want other members and newbies to see this as a happy friendly site. :)

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Post by Papy Ion » August 14, 2006, 11:54 am

Arjay, as you probably noticed, I have waited (more than 4 days) to see that Jingjai has posted something new in this forum before writing that I would have liked that he did not ignore my request for a clarification regarding the alleged declaration of a French ambassador. Don't forget that it was the main point of his post, and that this part is written in capital letters. It was not exactly a "friendly" remark, was it?

Anyway, I will show that I can be friendlier than some people may think I am and I won't request this clarification from our sincere member anymore... Ma๏ pen ra๏! I will consider all this story as a "honest mistake". At least, nobody was killed because of this one!

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Post by arjay » August 14, 2006, 12:45 pm

Papy, All points understood and agreed.

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Post by Dakoda » August 14, 2006, 1:19 pm

Well since I am mostly ignored on this site, guess I could add a post-mortem.

You should remember Papy that some Americans are a little upset with France (wonder when they will send back the statue?). I guess it was just before the invading of Iraq, most Americans were boycotting French products, me I switched from Italian wine to French wine. Why they were blaming France is beyond me.

Seems to me (although some here will not agree, but who cares) that the French Intelligence's was 100% accurate, while the American Intelligence's was cherry-picked to show something that was totally false and now the Middle East is ablaze in terrorism.

Score bin Laden 10 - bush 0. :P

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Post by jingjai » August 14, 2006, 1:56 pm

Papy Ion wrote:
Papy Ion wrote:
jingjai wrote:
beer monkey wrote:i think this was just a copy and paste of something that's doing the rounds on the Net.
Yes, you are right, I recieved it as a forwarded e-mail. How much of it is true, I don't know. I thought that even if 50% of it was true, it was worth a post. I think quite a bit of it is true though.
What about "your" free assertion about the alleged French ambassador's declaration? At least, this deserve a public apology unless you can prove it was really said!
Jingjai has apparently reappeared today, but he seems to have decided to ignore my previous post. How sincere are you, Jingjai?

I would have appreciated a few words of apology, something like: "I am sorry to have been so credulous and to have propagated this stupid rumor regarding a French ambassador, and you can trust me to explain that also to the person who sent me this message in the first place".

Yes, I know... I am a dreamer...
I stated in a previous post that the original post was sent to me as a e-mail. It was interesting to me because I did not realise or know many of the items mentioned and I thought that other forum members might find it interesting. Honestly, I didn't think it would turn into a three page thread. It is interesting though, that the only two discrepencies pointed out, so far, are the # of P.C.'s per capita and the size of the Air Force ( I don't think any country would make accurately public the size of their military). What about all the other stuff(?), ie: medical technology, computers, there is really too much to mention. I have no idea how much is true. Personally, I think most of it is. However, I do not have broadband and I'm not that savvy with researching stuff on the net, so I'm not going to take a day out of my life to verify all of it. If someone wants to, more power to you.
As far I know this is still a public forum and my right as a member is to be able to post whatever I want; whether it be info wanted or given on Udon, my opinions, or items that I find on the net that I think are interesting, amusing, or thought provoking. So, I will continue to post forwarded e-mails (if I think they are post-worthy) until the moderator or administrator tells me to stop.
IMO, ALL politicans from ALL countries are fair game. So who knows who made the comment in question. Maybe it was the French diplomat, maybe it was a member of his diplomatic mission, maybe it was a U.S. diplomat, maybe a British diplomat, or Italian, or Austrailian, or Canadian, or the Republic of Bongo Bongo. Who knows or who cares? Somewhere along the line, someone has said it or thought it, or written it. And that's why I posted it, because I'm sure many people think of the State of Israel as a dry spot of sand with a big air force in the mid-east.
So, Papy, there will be no aplogies forthcoming from ol' jingjai. I sincerely believe I have nothing to apologise for.

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Post by thlboston » August 14, 2006, 1:59 pm

Dakoda,

What does that mean: "bin Laden 10- bush 0? Do you have a rooting interest in this despicable clash?

Would the score have risen to say 17-0 if the terrorists had been able to succeed in the most recent plots? I'm assuming you're basing your scoring system on the American Football model.

Anyway, to me, this appears very callous as you seem to be making light of a situation where lives are being lost and families are being cast into despair.

If you simply mean to imply your opposition to the Bush Foreign Policy I believe there are other, less harsh/more articulate, ways in which to accomplish this. I, as an American, do not always agree with the policies of my government. But I do not gain satisfaction, nor act with glee when these policies result in the deaths of Americans, nor should I add, the death of anybody.

And if you find yourself ignored, well I wonder why?

THL

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Post by Papy Ion » August 14, 2006, 2:58 pm

jingjai wrote: I stated in a previous post that the original post was sent to me as a e-mail. It was interesting to me because I did not realise or know many of the items mentioned and I thought that other forum members might find it interesting. Honestly, I didn't think it would turn into a three page thread. It is interesting though, that the only two discrepencies pointed out, so far, are the # of P.C.'s per capita and the size of the Air Force ( I don't think any country would make accurately public the size of their military). What about all the other stuff(?), ie: medical technology, computers, there is really too much to mention. I have no idea how much is true. Personally, I think most of it is. However, I do not have broadband and I'm not that savvy with researching stuff on the net, so I'm not going to take a day out of my life to verify all of it. If someone wants to, more power to you.
As far I know this is still a public forum and my right as a member is to be able to post whatever I want; whether it be info wanted or given on Udon, my opinions, or items that I find on the net that I think are interesting, amusing, or thought provoking. So, I will continue to post forwarded e-mails (if I think they are post-worthy) until the moderator or administrator tells me to stop.
IMO, ALL politicans from ALL countries are fair game. So who knows who made the comment in question. Maybe it was the French diplomat, maybe it was a member of his diplomatic mission, maybe it was a U.S. diplomat, maybe a British diplomat, or Italian, or Austrailian, or Canadian, or the Republic of Bongo Bongo. Who knows or who cares? Somewhere along the line, someone has said it or thought it, or written it. And that's why I posted it, because I'm sure many people think of the State of Israel as a dry spot of sand with a big air force in the mid-east.
So, Papy, there will be no aplogies forthcoming from ol' jingjai. I sincerely believe I have nothing to apologise for.
About your list of "facts", as I have already explained somewhere in the forum, it is easier to prove that something exists or is true than the contrary (so, you should have given us sources). I don't have the time to perform an extensive search, but IMHO, many other statements made are unverifiable (where can I find a list of the number of museums in each country, for instance?).

Anyway, it was not the main point (if you read again my previous posts, you will notice that I agree that Israel is a very innovative country, especially in the IT industry, a domain which I know quite well).

For the clarification that I requested, I have my answer, in a way. I don't want to argue with you and others, Jingjai, but everybody is now able to have his/her own opinion about your "sincerity"...

Some of you (who received private messages from me) already know that I do not want to post something more in this thread. Therefore, I will try not to breach my promise again and won't post something more here.

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Post by john2005 » August 14, 2006, 3:36 pm

If you simply mean to imply your opposition to the Bush Foreign Policy I believe there are other, less harsh/more articulate, ways in which to accomplish this.
lighten up,this is an Udon Thani internet forum not a sitting session of the UN.It's nice to see an American without his head up his own arse.Nice one Dakoda. :D

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Post by Dakoda » August 14, 2006, 4:08 pm

Thanks john2005.

I thought I was posting the last post to this subject, think arjay saw the light.

Well call me callous if you want, but I am only expressing an opinion on a web site. Its worth all of 2 baht!

Maybe you should be directing your anger toward the real callous people, or asking yourself some questions!

What do the bin Laden's of this world want? What would constitute "winning" for them?

In my opinion some of the answers are as follows:

Terrorists want to terrorize. They want you to live in fear, to get inside your head, not just your subway stations or airports. They want you to lose your sense of casual safety. They want to disrupt your everyday routines, so that we have to entertain the possibility that they might strike at any moment. They want you to dwell upon the specter of their hatred, so that you too become haters. (Sorry if this sounds too much like the Bush Administration).

Let's face it, bin Laden is holed up in his cave some place and must be laughing. He is calling the shots, and he really doesn't have to lift a finger, for Bush is doing his bidding:

Bush's Administration has suspended civil liberties, defied the U.S. Constitution, junked the Geneva Convention, has tortured prisoners, oversaw criminal acts at Abu, while ignoring due process at Guantanamo and oversaw more criminal acts. He has engaged in domestic spying without court supervision, while flushing billions down the toilet in Iraq, and has set much of the world against the US.

America's internal politics have become poisonously divided, not united.

Score it any way you want, but it still zero for the real people whom love and fought for their freedom.

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Post by thlboston » August 14, 2006, 5:26 pm

Sorry John2005 if some of the posts here reflect a level of discourse that has left you befuddled. Perhaps, as some internet ESL sites do, an "easier" & "more difficult" option can be added to the forum in order to assist you to follow the proceedings.

And do you consider everybody who does not agree with you to "have his head up his own arse." Is this your way of rationalizing all things in your life? Anyway, enough with you as I trust you have lost me at this point. John2005 you may proceed to the nearest bar where you may find a more comfortable arena from where to carry on.

Dakoda, all right, I understand your points & agree with many of them. I hold no antipathy (sorry john2005) towards the French for their stance pre-Iraq, or even post-Iraq. I also cringe when I see the suspensions of many of our civil rights. Points well taken all.

But when we close "bin Laden 10 bush 0" it can leave a bad taste in the mouths of many. Remember the 9/11 anniversary is soon upon us and the blame for this event lies squarely with Bin Laden & his brood. I consider him a murderer & a coward. It is that simple! So if I may have overreacted in response to the "10-0" comment it was with this in mind.

And I do apologize for what was, upon reflection, a rather shrill response to what seems to be a throw-away line.

THL

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Fun Facts About Israel

Post by ctm » August 20, 2006, 12:56 pm

1. Did you know that non-Jewish Israelis cannot buy or lease land in Israel? A Jew from any country in the world is guaranteed citizenship in Israel, while the Palestinians who have been there for centuries are oppressed and persecuted.

2.Did you know that instead of sewing an insignia on clothing to distinguish race (like the Germans did to the Jews before WW2), Palestinian license plates in Israel are color coded to distinguish Jews from non-Jews?

3. Did you know that East Jerusalem, the West Bank, Gaza, and the Golan Heights are all considered by the entire world community, including the United States and the United Nations, to be occupied territory and NOT part of the State of Israel?

4. Did you know that Israel allots 85% of the water resources for Jews, and the remaining 15% is divided among all Palestinians in the territories? For example in Hebron, 85% of the water is set aside for about 400 Jewish settlers, while the remaining 15% is distributed among Hebron's 120, 000 Palestinians?

5.Did you know that the United States awards Israel $5 billion in aid each year from American tax dollars?

6.Did you know that US aid to Israel ($1.8 billion annually in military aid alone) exceeds the aid the US grants to the entire African continent? This aid is used both to buy American weaponry and to buy arms made in Israel.

7. Did you know that Israel is awaiting an additional $4 billion worth of American military hardware, including new F-16s and Apache and Blackhawk helicopters. As Israel's main ally and supporter internationally, the United States is committed to maintaining the Jewish state's "qualitative edge" in weapons over its neighbors.

8. Did you know that the U.S. administration has notified Congress on numerous occasions that Israel has violated the rules on how US-supplied weapons are used? (In 1978, 1979 and 1982 during fighting in Lebanon, and once after Israel's bombing of an Iraqi nuclear reactor in 1981.)

9. Did you know that Israel is the only country in the Middle East that refuses to sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and bars international inspections from its sites?

10. Did you know that high-ranking military officers in the Israeli Defense Forces have admitted publicly that unarmed prisoners of war have been summarily executed by the Israeli forces?

11. Did you know that Israel blew up an American diplomatic facility in Egypt and attacked a US warship in international waters (the USS Liberty), killing 33 and wounding 177 American sailors and the US did nothing about it? (Imagine if an Islamic country like Iraq did this!)

12. Did you know that Israel stands in defiance of 69 United Nations Security Council Resolutions?

13. Did you know that Israel is explicitly dedicated to the policy of maintaining a distinct Jewish character?

14. Did you know that Israel's current Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, was found by an Israeli court to be "personally and directly responsible" for the Sabra and Shatilla massacre in Lebanon where more than a thousand innocent Palestinian men, women, and children were axed to death or lined up and shot in cold blood?

15. Did you know that on May 20, 1990, a group of unarmed Palestinian laborers were lined up and murdered by an Israeli solider as they sat waiting for transportation back to Gaza? The terrified laborers who gathered in an area of southern Israel known as Rishon Lezion (known to Palestinians by its Arabic name Oyon Qara) handed their ID cards to the Israeli soldier. The soldiers ordered the distressed laborers to kneel down and face the ground and unexpectedly showered them with a barrage of bullets, killing seven and wounding many others. Needless to say, the soldier was not charged with any crime.

16. Did you know that until as recently as 1988, Israelis were permitted to run "Jews Only" job ads?

17. Did you know that the Israeli Foreign Ministry pays six US public relations firms to promote a "positive image" of Israel to the American public?

18. Did you know that Sharon's coalition government includes a party--Molodet--which advocates ethnic cleansing by openly calling for the forced expulsion of all Palestinians from the occupied territories?

19. Did you know that recently-declassified documents indicate that David Ben-Gurion approved of the forced expulsion of Arabs from all Palestininan territory in 1948?

20. Did you know that the former chief rabbi of Israel, Rabbi Ovadia Yossef, who is also a founder and spiritual leader of the religious Shas party (Israel's third largest political party) openly advocates a 'Final Solution' to annihilate the Palestinians? Speaking at the widely broadcast sermon marking the last Passover, he declared of the Palestinians: "The Lord shall return their deeds on their own heads, waste their seed and exterminate them, devastate them and vanish them from this world. It is forbidden to be merciful to them. You must send missiles to them and annihilate them. They are evil and damnable."

21. Did you know that Palestinian refugees make up the largest portion of the refugee population in the world?

22. Did you know that Palestinian Christians are considered the "living stones" of Christianity because they are the direct descendants of the disciples of Jesus Christ? And the Palestinian Christians stand united with their Muslim brethren in the struggle against the Israeli occupation.

23. Did you know that despite a ban on torture by Israel's High Court of Justice, torture has continued unabated by Shin Bet interrogators on Palestinian prisoners?

24. Did you know that despite every Israeli attempt to disrupt Palestinian education, Palestinians have the highest ratio of PhDs per capita in the world?

25. Did you know that the right of self-determination is guaranteed to every human being under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights [December, 1948], yet Palestinians were/are expected to negotiate for this right under the Oslo Accords?

26. Did you know that despite what is widely perpetuated and written in the history books that the Arabs attacked Israel in the 1967 war, it was Israel who attacked the Arab countries first, capturing Jerusalem and the West Bank, and called the attack a pre-emptive strike?

27. Did you know that, as an occupying power, Israel has a particular responsibility under the Geneva Conventions to protect Palestinian civilians?

28. Did you know that, despite Ariel Sharon's public call for a unilateral ceasefire, Israeli soldiers have not stopped shooting, killing or bulldozing Palestinian homes? The most recent example of this is the murder of three innocent women who were shot by an Israeli tank as they sat in their tent!

29. Did you know that the Zionists have been trying to destroy Masjid al-Aqsa and the Dome of the Rock for the last 50 years by digging underground tunnels beneath the sites to weaken its foundation causing it to collapse?

30) Nelson Mandela called the Israeli government an apartheid regime, just like South Africa used to be.

valentine

Post by valentine » August 20, 2006, 2:22 pm

No I didn't know any of those things. what can I do about it :?:

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Post by JimboPSM » August 20, 2006, 7:10 pm

ctm, this is a very sensitive and emotive area to many people; as there is a lot of misinformation on the internet, would it be possible to add some appropriate and verifiable sources to your post to add to its credibility?

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Post by john2005 » August 20, 2006, 8:43 pm

would it be possible to add some appropriate and verifiable sources to your post to add to its credibility?
..and i hope that applies to jingjai's original post that started the thread.The whole thread lacks subjectivity with the poster on the wonders of Israel being a jew himself. :roll:

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Post by jingjai » August 20, 2006, 10:30 pm

I already stated twice, the original post was a copy and paste of a e-mail I recieved. I believe most of it is true, if not all. I'm under no obligation to prove anything. If john2005 and the rest of you doubters want to, go for it.
I'm unchecking "notify me when a reply is posted".
Shalom!

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Post by ctm » August 21, 2006, 2:41 pm

I didn't fact check nor am I going to. Facts are everywhere that Israel is the number one outlaw rogue state in the world. Anyone who wants to, feel free to check and report back.

Oh, wait....holocaust, victim, Hitler, holocaust., anti-semite, holocaust.

I just wanted to counter the propaganda BS that Israel is some great bastion of freedom and democracy. More like a militarized pseudo democracy where citizens are taught to hate and kill from birth.

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Post by john2005 » August 21, 2006, 10:27 pm

The growing viciousness and brutality of the Zionist regime has been laid bare during its incursion into Lebanon.The wanton destruction of homes and property and the deliberate targeting of civilians are aimed at terrorising the Lebanese population and give no prospect of an end to the violence.

The scale of the regime

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Post by jingjai » August 22, 2006, 2:10 pm

These words are attributed to: MajGen Richard Cooke, USMC (Ret). (But, since I cannot verify it, I will state this is 100% MY sentiments!
Is that acceptable to everyone who says I should verify everything I post?)
"I often mention in my posts a little Mexican restaurant that I frequent here in San Diego that goes by the name of Las Quatro Milpas, which serves the best authentic Mexican food in San Diego. I mention it today, because of what has changed when I stand in that long line in the heat down on Logan Avenue waiting for those 5 dear Mexican woman to serve the hundreds of us who show up before I melt in the hot sun.

The line outside of Quatro Milpas is a place to meet new friends, reunite with people you have not seen in weeks or months, but happen to get that same desire for that Chorizo at the same time you did, so that every time you show up again, you can restart your friendship as if it never stopped. Everyone has a story about how long they have been coming to Quatro Milpas or how they discovered it, or how long was the longest line they have stood in waiting to get to their food.

What has changed, is that this week, instead of the jovial mood in the line, I was struck with the thought of what would happen to this place if someone were to walk into the line, and get into the restaurant, around say
1300 hours, at the height of the lunch rush and blow about 100 people to hell in the name of Allah.

As I thought about this, I wondered what it must be like for the people if Israel, who no matter where they go, have to consider the possibility of terrorism, and that their next steps out into society might be their last. I thought about what it must be like for a little Israeli schoolchild on a bus heading from school when someone gets on the bus in the middle of summer wearing a large overcoat.

I have an anger that will not go away this morning, as I watch the media try to tell me that Israel is the aggressor, that they are wantonly killing civilians, and that they must agree to a cease-fire with people who have sworn to kill them. I wish I could say I cannot imagine how we got to this point in society, where a portion of our society would side with the very monsters that have killed both Israelis and Americans, because of a fear of violence, but the reason is all too clear.

The free world has been too tolerant of the non-free world. We have allowed them to be portrayed as victims, and to assume the moral high ground at the same time that they cut the heads off innocent people and film it for worldwide consumption. Okay, that is the nice way to put it. The honest way to put it is that we have lost our nerve. When a society of radicals can drag a dead American through the streets of their towns, and hang their bodies from a bridge as a collective finger flashed at America, and our response is "patience" we have lost not only our nerves, but our balls as well.

I get a sense from the older veteran friends of mine in this city that our problem is that we have it too good, and do not remember what was done on our behalf to make things this good. Have we forgotten that for every time we can leave our homes, go stand in line at our favorite restaurant, and NOT think about the possibility of someone bombing the place, which someone many years ago gave their very life for that freedom we enjoy? I think the young people in line at Quatro Milpas and wonder how many of them would have volunteered to fly with along side Doolittle on his way to Tokyo, knowing they had not the gas to get home? Omaha Beach, anyone? I understand that these days, in Marine Corps boot camp, a recruit can call a "time out" if he is feeling too much stress. Is our State Dept. running the Marines now? This, I find disgusting.

But no more disgusting then those who seek a cease-fire in Lebanon this morning after civilians were killed after their building collapsed from the concussion of a bomb dropped near them that was targeting the site of where rockets were launched into Israel resulting in the deaths of 18 Israeli civilians. It is as though these Israeli deaths do not matter at all. Especially when you stop to consider that this conflict began with Hezbollah coming across the Israeli border, ambushing and killing 8 Israeli soldiers and kidnapping two more.

Cease-fire, my ass!

To every person who believes that you can reason with these animals, I must ask you where your mind went. It is the weakness of the free-world's NON-response that has allowed the terrorist threat to grow into a movement that threatens our very existence. When a U.S. soldier can be dragged through the streets of Somalia and our response is to LEAVE, when 280 Marines can be bombed in their sleep and our response is to LEAVE, when after terrorists kill Spanish civilians on a train, and their nation's response is to elect capitulating socialists who order the immediate retreat of their soldiers from Iraq, and so on, and so on, what are the terrorists to think, but that the free world has become a pussy?

The fact that a majority of Americans think this nation needs AN EXCUSE for going after terrorism after 911 scares the hell out of me. It suggests that we as a nation will eventually fail to produce the men and women who every day, stand between freedom and tyranny. Yesterday, San Diego had its Gay Pride Parade. Oh, the joy.. It was billed as the largest 'celebration' in the cities history. THIS city. The very city where sailors came home to after fighting in Midway. The city that trains half of this nations Marines, hosts the USS Ronald Reagan, the USS Nimitz, the former Fightertown USA...our largest celebration is for the GAY...PRIDE..PARADE. Ponder that with me, will you?

We are at war.

I want Israel to continue, even escalate their attacks on Lebanon. I want them to ignore the media, ignore the pundits, and ignore even the weak among them who want to find a peaceful way out of this current conflict. History teaches us that until a bully is beaten, the bully keeps coming. The free world paid for our freedom in blood, and if blood is what it will take to keep it, then lets just have at it now, shall we?

Let Iran and Syria attempt to aid Hezbollah. Let Israel attack them. Let it escalate until we are forced to fight at Israel's side. Then, can we for the last time, just kick some ass until it is over? Every generation must pay this price, as long as there are those who seek to force us to follow a dictatorial ideology. Radical Islam says, "Agree or die." In response, we should stop asking them, if there is a middle ground to be reached. We should be saying, "Fine, but it is YOU that will die."

Israel, I see you fighting not just for your freedoms, but also for the world's. I trust that if you continue, the free world will be forced to side with you, even if it means that a few of us die in the process. The time is now. It is time for THIS generation to prove itself worthy of those that came before us. It is time for us to say NO MORE to the terrorist threat, to find them and kill them.

Do not stop fighting, Israel. Make the free world help you put an end to this madness. In doing so, you might help us find the courage and moral convictions that made us free to begin with, so that one day, little Jewish children, and old lovers of Mexican food in America can go about our daily lives with the freedom that others died to give us."

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