LED Bulbs

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rjj04
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LED Bulbs

Post by rjj04 » July 21, 2017, 11:41 am

LED Bulb quality problems...

My house is about three years old now. I fitted LED bulbs throughout the house and on my perimeter wall. I have had many failures of these bulbs over those three years. At this moment I am looking at seven bulbs I have had to replace in the last couple of weeks. Five bulbs are BioBulb, and one each of Gata and Eve. All these are cheap (locally manufactured I think) brands. Being a cheap charlie, I typically buy low end products when it comes to electronics as replacement costs decline so fast. This strategy works out pretty well most of the time but in this case I'd advise anybody to buy quality LED bulbs. At around 100 THB a pop, and using dozens in your typical house, having to replace a good portion of them in 2-3 years (or less sometimes) when their lifetime (as advertised) is supposed to be ten years or more, it is not worth the 30% or so lower price. Not to mention all the time you waste to go and replace the damn things. Sylvania bulbs seem to last quite a while but I don't have enough of them (small sample size) to advise buying that brand.

Note: these bulbs did not just fail outside in the heat, but inside rooms that are constantly air-conditioned !!!

Anybody else see this?

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by eagle » July 21, 2017, 12:43 pm

rjj04 wrote:
July 21, 2017, 11:41 am
LED Bulb quality problems...

My house is about three years old now. I fitted LED bulbs throughout the house and on my perimeter wall. I have had many failures of these bulbs over those three years. At this moment I am looking at seven bulbs I have had to replace in the last couple of weeks. Five bulbs are BioBulb, and one each of Gata and Eve. All these are cheap (locally manufactured I think) brands. Being a cheap charlie, I typically buy low end products when it comes to electronics as replacement costs decline so fast. This strategy works out pretty well most of the time but in this case I'd advise anybody to buy quality LED bulbs. At around 100 THB a pop, and using dozens in your typical house, having to replace a good portion of them in 2-3 years (or less sometimes) when their lifetime (as advertised) is supposed to be ten years or more, it is not worth the 30% or so lower price. Not to mention all the time you waste to go and replace the damn things. Sylvania bulbs seem to last quite a while but I don't have enough of them (small sample size) to advise buying that brand.

Note: these bulbs did not just fail outside in the heat, but inside rooms that are constantly air-conditioned !!!

Anybody else see this?
I have had Gata and Eve led bulbs without problems.

One must remember that placing led bulbs into enclosed fittings (like light on perimeter wall) needs special bulbs made to be ably to install inside enclosed fittings (read: very expensive). Normal led bulb age could be only from few hundred hours to 2000 - 3000 hours inside enclosed fitting. Same inside house, no enclosed fittings woth normal led bulbs.

Bulb itself does not get hot, but electronics inside and that heat does not go out from enclosed fitting.

I believe that you have enclosed fittings on perimeter wall (because of rain), but how about inside the house? Open or enclosed?

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rjj04
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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by rjj04 » July 21, 2017, 1:16 pm

eagle wrote:
July 21, 2017, 12:43 pm
rjj04 wrote:
July 21, 2017, 11:41 am
LED Bulb quality problems...

My house is about three years old now. I fitted LED bulbs throughout the house and on my perimeter wall. I have had many failures of these bulbs over those three years. At this moment I am looking at seven bulbs I have had to replace in the last couple of weeks. Five bulbs are BioBulb, and one each of Gata and Eve. All these are cheap (locally manufactured I think) brands. Being a cheap charlie, I typically buy low end products when it comes to electronics as replacement costs decline so fast. This strategy works out pretty well most of the time but in this case I'd advise anybody to buy quality LED bulbs. At around 100 THB a pop, and using dozens in your typical house, having to replace a good portion of them in 2-3 years (or less sometimes) when their lifetime (as advertised) is supposed to be ten years or more, it is not worth the 30% or so lower price. Not to mention all the time you waste to go and replace the damn things. Sylvania bulbs seem to last quite a while but I don't have enough of them (small sample size) to advise buying that brand.

Note: these bulbs did not just fail outside in the heat, but inside rooms that are constantly air-conditioned !!!

Anybody else see this?
I have had Gata and Eve led bulbs without problems.

One must remember that placing led bulbs into enclosed fittings (like light on perimeter wall) needs special bulbs made to be ably to install inside enclosed fittings (read: very expensive). Normal led bulb age could be only from few hundred hours to 2000 - 3000 hours inside enclosed fitting. Same inside house, no enclosed fittings woth normal led bulbs.

Bulb itself does not get hot, but electronics inside and that heat does not go out from enclosed fitting.

I believe that you have enclosed fittings on perimeter wall (because of rain), but how about inside the house? Open or enclosed?
Yes, I understand that on the perimeter wall they will get hot (as they are sealed)... although it is also at night-time so ambient temps go down. But yes, enclosed like that they will take a beating on the power conversion electronics. On the other hand, some bulbs on the wall seem to be having no problems whatsoever.

Inside the house, some of the bulb enclosures have glass on the bottom side, some don't. I believe, looking at the fixtures when we bought them, that most have holes on the top sides, so they must have circulation into the ceiling. Heck, if the geckos can go in and out of them as they please (with and without glass bottoms), then I assume the heat can escape either way. Of course the ceiling is insulated and will be a bit warmer, but once again, in an air-conditioned room. Most have failed inside the house, by far. Of course there are many more inside the house than on the wall outside... so.

At any rate, I am sorely disappointed in these local brands. 40,000, 50,000 hours, ..., what a joke.

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Barney
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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by Barney » July 21, 2017, 2:04 pm

rjj04

Just advise are you using replacement LED lamps in normal fitting or did you install a whole LED fixture?

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by rjj04 » July 21, 2017, 3:13 pm

Barney wrote:
July 21, 2017, 2:04 pm
rjj04

Just advise are you using replacement LED lamps in normal fitting or did you install a whole LED fixture?
Sorry, not sure if I understand the question. I am just replacing standard E27 type bulbs. 5-10W types. The fixtures do not seem to be a problem, at least I don't see any rust or anything mysterious on the contacts. Did that answer your question?

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by Barney » July 21, 2017, 3:39 pm

rjj04 wrote:
July 21, 2017, 3:13 pm
Barney wrote:
July 21, 2017, 2:04 pm
rjj04

Just advise are you using replacement LED lamps in normal fitting or did you install a whole LED fixture?
Sorry, not sure if I understand the question. I am just replacing standard E27 type bulbs. 5-10W types. The fixtures do not seem to be a problem, at least I don't see any rust or anything mysterious on the contacts. Did that answer your question?
Yeah
Just clarifying whether your changing out normal lamps and replacing with LED lamps or you purchased complete new LED fixtures and replacing those lamps.

I have about 50 Eve LED down lights in my new place, which in my small research with out trials that showed them to be reliable. I can monitor now if certain positions in and around the house are more susceptible to failure.
The Eve ceiling downlight type I eventually chose had a good size cooling fin attached for the roof space and I have ensured that there is good clearance from the thick ceiling insulation batts. They have been in casual short time use now for a few months with no failure. One thing I didn't check was if the complete LED fixture procured had any temperature rating, either ambient or working, on the name plate or manufacturer's install booklet.
Thanks for your thread it has given me something to check now.

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rjj04
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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by rjj04 » July 21, 2017, 4:10 pm

I hadn't realized that the "Eve" brand made complete fixtures. Thus the confusion I guess.

You made me think about the insulation. I wasn't here when they installed it, so perhaps the insulation is covering the top of the fixtures. Then again, we did not put much (if any) insulation in the first floor... as I figured the stairwell would vector the heat up that way (which it certainly does... that's the hottest part of the house). Wifey doesn't like air-con much but the first floor stays quite cool with the q-con. The bulbs fail in the first floor as well, so I don't think the insulation is the problem. It seems you researched the fixtures quite well. "Perhaps" the fixtures we used do not have much heat dissipation capability. I probably should have done more research... live and learn. So far I haven't seen any quality brand bulbs fail, so I'll just continue to make replacements with them.

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by kopkei » July 22, 2017, 7:21 pm

first we always used saving lamps , but now we also use led bulbs on the lights of the gate , strangely enough the last bulbs i bought are lasting the longest (at nongprajak evening market) 3 bulbs for 100 baht , bought 6 free 1 so 7 for 200..
problem sometimes is not the quality of the bulbs , but the quality of your electric installation , as led lights are very sensitive ... ;)

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by rjj04 » July 22, 2017, 11:42 pm

kopkei wrote:
July 22, 2017, 7:21 pm
problem sometimes is not the quality of the bulbs , but the quality of your electric installation , as led lights are very sensitive ... ;)
poor sensitive little things :lol:

Hmmm, firstly, you have never been to my house, and therefore do not know what the "electrical installation" is. It is the same as the average Thai house as a Thai electrician did the installation with typical Thai derived fixtures. Secondly, "led lights are very sensitive", it is an electrical circuit. It can be tested in burn in testing at a production facility if a company cares to spend the time and money to understand their bulb design's weaknesses. Please do feel free to elaborate about the design of LED bulbs and how those designs interact with the "electrical installation" of my house in particular, as you apparently are very well informed. Perhaps some circuit diagrams, analysis, and such. Now that might add to the conversation. Thx. ;)

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by rick » July 23, 2017, 5:04 pm

No one mentioned the actual wattage of these LED bulbs. Generally, LED's don't generate much heat - and the low wattage LED's do not need any special cooling (thinking LED's under 10 watts). Recently higher wattage bulbs have become available but i also notice that these often have cooling fins attached - so maybe they generate enough heat to need cooling. We have 9 - 8 watt bulbs in the kitchen ceiling, not sure brand, but about 60 baht each while on offer. Just a plain bulb, no fancy vents or fins. Have been working for about 6 months no problem. The recessed fittings they are in were dirt cheap.

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Re: LED Bulbs

Post by fdimike » July 23, 2017, 8:59 pm

I've had numerous failures with Eve LEDs & Nagas LEDs in ceiling fixtures as well as outside in enclosed wall lamps. I've since replaced them with Phillips LED bulbs which advise that they can be used in 3" ceiling fixtures. I've had zero failures with any of the Phillips bulbs inside or outside the house. More impressive as far as I'm concerned is the fact that all our ceiling fixtures are covered by an decorative etched glass plate on the bottom. The outside wall fixtures enclosed and are on all night.
An ex-pat in the Land of Smile

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