Support the Tourist Police

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JimboPSM
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Post by JimboPSM » June 11, 2007, 1:30 am

Sorry Stan, I wasn't actually trying to clarify the situation re the TP per se.

What was new to me was that a visa could apparently now be obtained in the UK for volunteer work in Thailand with a "Volunteer Worker Sponser Letter" - that visa might possibly apply to the TP :?

It is more than possible that this may be in conflict with other laws and regulations - but would anyone really be surprised if it was?

If it is in conflict, which law or rule would take precedence?

Does the word "precedence" translate into Thai?

It all brings to mind the song "There are more questions than answers" by Johnny Nash from the wonderfully ironically labelled album - "I Can See Clearly Now" :lol:



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BKKSTAN
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Post by BKKSTAN » June 11, 2007, 7:18 am

I think the visa only allows entry into the country.The work permit is for approved work whether paid or volunteer work.Maybe one can get a visa for tourist police volunteer work!If so,I wonder how many of the volunteers are doing it for the visa?

I think the retired stamped visa rules out ALL work , volunteered or paid!

laphanphon

Post by laphanphon » June 11, 2007, 10:14 am

stop it, you all forget where you are, TIT, if it's beneficial for locals, all rules and laws are ignored, not exactly a bad thing some times. though contradictory to my other post on different thread, but all victimless offences. 8)

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Post by Bob4you » June 13, 2007, 2:33 am

[quote="BKKSTAN"]I think the visa only allows entry into the country.The work permit is for approved work whether paid or volunteer work.Maybe one can get a visa for tourist police volunteer work!If so,I wonder how many of the volunteers are doing it for the visa?

I think the retired stamped visa rules out ALL work , volunteered or paid![/quote

No work permits given or required, we are told that since the Thai government wants and requests us to volunteer we are exempt. Now in Thailand it may mean that the officials are told to look the other way. TAT

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BKKSTAN
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Post by BKKSTAN » June 13, 2007, 4:01 am

Bob4you wrote:
BKKSTAN wrote:I think the visa only allows entry into the country.The work permit is for approved work whether paid or volunteer work.Maybe one can get a visa for tourist police volunteer work!If so,I wonder how many of the volunteers are doing it for the visa?

I think the retired stamped visa rules out ALL work , volunteered or paid![/quote

No work permits given or required, we are told that since the Thai government wants and requests us to volunteer we are exempt. Now in Thailand it may mean that the officials are told to look the other way. TAT
:lol: Of course,they would not enforce the law in an area that is of benefit to them :lol: I was wondering if a falang could get a visa and WP to be a TP volunteer?Could be an interesting option!What do you think? ;)

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Post by cookie » June 13, 2007, 12:01 pm

Bob4you wrote:I am a TPV in Pattaya, we are always looking for other foreigners to join the group, currently their are about a dozen farangs here. The qualifications to join in Pattaya are 1. clean police record, 2. speak fluent English, 3. complete a 1 day training and 3 months probation. 4. ability to speak Thai is helpful but not essential. 5. a desire to help farangs with a need for assistance 6. be willing to devote 6-10 hours a week volunteering.

We receive no pay. pay for our own uniforms and equipment. When on patrol we are always with another volunteer and in radio contact if need be to the armed police. We do not need a work permit as we are assisting a government agency at their request.

To put it mildly we are there to help not hurt. The only undercover operations I am aware of are drug, *** and foreign prostitute sting operations.

I hope this clears up some of the misconceptions and I would encourage all of you that meet the requirements and want to give back to the community to get involved.
No work permits given or required, we are told that since the Thai government wants and requests us to volunteer we are exempt. Now in Thailand it may mean that the officials are told to look the other way. TAT
Great way to start to work as a volunteer for the Thai Police:
"officials are told to look the other way"?????????????? :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: =P~ =P~ =P~ =P~ #-o #-o #-o #-o #-o
Is that the kind of officials you want to work together with as a volunteer...............?????????

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Doc
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Post by Doc » June 13, 2007, 1:07 pm

Way too much speculation here about the need for a work permit to work as a volunteer for the tourist police.

Maybe someone that likes to slam and criticize all that the Thais do would like to expend some time finding out the actual facts???? Think then what you could really do with that information!!!!

Personally - I don't care whether or not a work permit is needed. I have much more important things to think about and accomplish. (Read as: Doc has a life.)

In other words - those who are volunteering their time - and personal resources, and possibly putting their lives and personal safety on the line - are doing something truly beneficial for Thailand and the community that they live in. If, as has been suggested, that someone has gotten a work permit and visa based solely upon his service to the public - so what. At least that person is giving something and doing something productive.

Life isn't black and white. Never has been and never will be. If there is an exemption for a work permit for those that are doing work for the government - so what. If the government is waiving a requirement for those doing work for the government, so what.

I really think that some of you need to get a life....
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BKKSTAN
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Post by BKKSTAN » June 13, 2007, 2:14 pm

:lol: Just imagine us all having a life like you doc,then we would have your expert antagonistic personality! :yikes: No thanks,you think to know to mut and enjoy being a pain if your not accepted as an expert!
You may be the expert in your life,but you don't know sh*t about mine!

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Doc
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Post by Doc » June 13, 2007, 2:29 pm

BKKSTAN wrote::lol: Just imagine us all having a life like you doc,then we would have your expert antagonistic personality! :yikes: No thanks,you think to know to mut and enjoy being a pain if your not accepted as an expert!
You may be the expert in your life,but you don't know sh*t about mine!
Only you could turn this into a personal attack Stanley.

Yes, I am an expert in my life. Believe that I will keep it that way.

As for your life - as pitiful as I perceive it to be - I really don't want to know too much about it. The fact that you bloviate and post anything and everything that you can that is anti Thai simply makes me - and countless others that PM me and talk to me - wonder why in the he11 you are here in Thailand. The final conclusion that has been collectively reached is that you really do need to get a life besides the Udon Thani Forum.

And before you come back at me with your drivel - remember that you are the one that made the personal attack here - not me. [-X [-X [-X
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Post by cookie » June 13, 2007, 2:42 pm

Guys, guys,
stop the fighting.
Just found that there is a kind of visa for volunteer work:

http://www.thaiconsul-uk.com/pdfs/Ad%20 ... mation.pdf

Don't know very good how to do this.
It is a PDF file with the legal explanation from the Royal Thai Consul in Hull about an Additional Pack for Visa for Volunteer Work.

I don't know how I can add a Pdf file to this message , sorry

http://www.thaiconsul-uk.com/pdfs/Ad%20 ... mation.pdf

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Post by nemesis » June 13, 2007, 4:23 pm

There are TPV's in town who are not called any longer for patrols or volunteer work. It seems that they have not (ever) actually done any regular service (but perhaps they "bloviated?" about doing it). So why would the TP go out on a limb to obtain work visas if the individual hasn't proven himself to be active and dependable? It sounds odd.

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Post by Aardvark » June 13, 2007, 5:38 pm

Personally I'd be worried about running into some monster who has made violence a hobby, who can fight like ten men when he's drunk, let alone sober[think ex military with PTS] A guy like me would be like flicking a cornflake to one side. Its all very well to want to help, but who wants to end up a cripple, or worse. Best leave it to the Professionals who carry guns and get thier Bht200 a day No sarcasm intended. :?

laphanphon

Post by laphanphon » June 13, 2007, 5:49 pm

first of all, you all need to stop using words i have to look up, especially if using past and present participle.

bloviate

bloทviทate [blṓ vee เyt]
(past and past participle bloทviทatทed, present participle bloทviทatทing, 3rd person present singular bloทviทates)
intransitive verb
speak bombastically: to speak at length in a pompous self-aggrandizing way (slang)


[Mid-19th century. Mock Latin alteration of blow1 ]


-bloทviทaทtion [blvee แysh'n], , noun
Microsoftฎ Encartaฎ 2006. ฉ 1993-2005 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

and yes, like there isn't a couple more i need to look up to understand that definition. don't you just hate that.

Doc, don't know you, but your self description scares me :shock: , will probably get around to meeting you sooner or later, have probably seen you a few times, just didn't know it, and visa/versa. i always keep an open mind 8) , as i hope most people do about me. i scare me sometimes :shock:

Stan, know you, and a good friend, you always smile, so life is good. may you squeeze at least another decade out of it. same as me, simply enjoying family and retirement, and making the best of some frustating situations, which come with living here and everywhere. wish i had somewhere close and interesting to ride my bike,oh well. God bless.

valentine

Post by valentine » June 13, 2007, 9:15 pm

I don,t know if my experience will throw any light on the subject. Firstly we have 2 English girls working in the orphanage, they have volunteer visas valid for a year at a time. They are specific to the establishment they carry out their volunteer duties, cannot be used anywhere else and must be surrendered if they want to leave.They are allowed reasonable personal expenses but do not receive a salary, although I believe they get something from the organisation that sent them here.
I , on the other hand am on a retirement visa, and as everyone says, I am not allowed to work, either paid or voluntary. I do however assist with the govt welfare dept at their request. I understand assisting a government department is not classified as working, so apparently a work permit is not required. This sounds awfully like what may be the case with the volunteer tourist police. But in truth I don,t really know.

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Post by Pakawala » June 13, 2007, 10:32 pm

Doc and Harry 1354, I have lived in Udon for a year and a half and have frequented many of the local and farang establishments since my arrival although I'm not 'out' every night. In my time here I have actually seen the Tourist Police on ONE (1) occasion when they came (en mass) to the City Lodge where we were having a golf party after a tournament. I talked with a few of them and they all seemed very friendly and that was it - they stayed for about 15 minutes. This was about 8 months ago and I've not seen any of them since. I was actually wondering if they were still active? I have their phone number in my cellphone... JIC.

One more comment... what or who is the 'dream team'? :? (Sorry I'm so naive.)

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Post by beer monkey » June 13, 2007, 10:36 pm

The "Dream Team" are here... DREAM TEAM !! . Image

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Doc
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Post by Doc » June 13, 2007, 11:52 pm

laphanphon wrote:Doc, don't know you, but your self description scares me :shock: , will probably get around to meeting you sooner or later, have probably seen you a few times, just didn't know it, and visa/versa. i always keep an open mind 8) , as i hope most people do about me. i scare me sometimes :shock:
Unlike some people here on the forum - I do tell it the way that I see it. I do not assume a different personality when I post things here. I will tell you to your face what I think and believe. Contrary to your praise of Stan below - to your face he can be a good person - but in my personal opinion - after many go arounds with Stanley - he assumes another personality when he gets behind the anoniminity of a computer screen. And yes, many other people agree with me.
laphanphon wrote:Stan, know you, and a good friend, you always smile, so life is good.
In person - yes - that is Stanley, Bless His Heart. :lol: Give him a computer and the ability to be somewhat anonymous - a different story. That's when he turns and starts slamming everything about the Thais - which is why I go after him. If I saw him face to face - I would tell him the same things that I write.

[quote ="Pakawala"]In my time here I have actually seen the Tourist Police on ONE (1) occasion when they came (en mass) to the City Lodge where we were having a golf party after a tournament. I talked with a few of them and they all seemed very friendly and that was it - they stayed for about 15 minutes. This was about 8 months ago and I've not seen any of them since.[/quote]

You identify a major problem that the Tourist Police face on a daily baisis: (And yes - I am going to rag on Stanley because he is part of the problem with all of his anti-Thai and Thai corruption propaganda) People simply have no idea of what the Tourist Police are here for - as well as the volunteers - and they do ABSOLUTELY nothing to try to find out what the purpose and reason is for. Instead - we have people like Stan tha try to find corruption in everything that is going on.

The Tourist Police are here to help falangs. They will help any falang - you, me, even Stanley - without any corruption involved. The falangs - foreigners such as myself (with a long history in long enforcement) work with the Tourist Police to try to assist and help falangs - no matter what their condition is - to ensure that they do not get caught up in the Thai criminal justice system. I have delt with many falangs here that, in my home country - would have been locked up in the local jail without any second thoughts.

Stanley - and Cookie with his last post about the Tourist Police - besmirches their reputation and actually serves them a disservice - because NEITHER ON OF THEM know anything about the Tourist Police or what they do.
nemesis wrote:There are TPV's in town who are not called any longer for patrols or volunteer work. It seems that they have not (ever) actually done any regular service (but perhaps they "bloviated?" about doing it). So why would the TP go out on a limb to obtain work visas if the individual hasn't proven himself to be active and dependable? It sounds odd.
The volunteers can show up any time that they want to and go out on patrols. Any volunteer - or anyone else that wants to walk into the TP station - can be put to work in one way or another. In other words - if the falang shows up for the evening patrol - and wants to walk up and down falang alley - the regular Tourist Police would be thrilled to death.

The PROBLEM is that the falangs here - Brits, Americans, Aussies and whatever - refuse to accept the fact that the Tourist Police and the Volunteers are actually here to HELP falangs - (your individual nationality) when they have problems here. Instead - the accusations fly that the Volunteers are here to "arrest / bust" other falangs which plays into Stan's rhetoric that everything about Thailand is "anti-falang."

Yes - if a falang is definately doing something wrong - and will not back off - he can be arrested by the TP or even a volunteer. But, having worked with the Tourist Police for over a year now - they go out of their way to AVOID arresting a foreigner. In fact - if the truth be known - I would much rather spend my free time with ALL of the regular Tourist Police than a significant number of the falangs that I know here. The primary difference is that they will tell you - to your face - what they think and belive about you. Wish that I could say the same about the a lot of the falangs that I have met here.

And yes Stanley - I am on a roll here now: Nah - I'm not going to tell you why I belive that you are a very insecure pissant - it would be totally lost on you because you don't have enough hair in a specific nether region to come and talk to me in person. =D> :D :lol:
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BKKSTAN
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Post by BKKSTAN » June 14, 2007, 4:30 am


Doc spewed:

''Stanley - and Cookie with his last post about the Tourist Police - besmirches their reputation and actually serves them a disservice - because NEITHER ON OF THEM know anything about the Tourist Police or what they do. ''

my reply:
Other than 4 joke replies to cookie and coot,These are my posts on this thread!

Maybe doc can point out how I''besmirche their reputation and actually serve them a disservice''!



My post:
Laughing I don't know about Udon,but the tourist police in Bangkok are quick to let you know that they are there for tourists not residents! Rolling Eyes
Laughing No,they don't ask for your passport.They simply ask if you live here or on holiday!When asked ,you say holiday,no problem! Rolling Eyes
2 comments related to my experience with the TP in Bangkok only,as I have no experience with them in Udon(facts that I think others might benefit from while in BK)

someones post:
''You are having problems with a Thai merchant, for example - the Tourist Police are the ones that can go in and mediate with and for you.''

my post:

Even though we are on a retrement visa?
Having no experience with the Udon TP,I asked this question!

My question to the TPV's:
Laughing I am really interested in why you volunteers are really playing ''cops here?Did you do this in your native country?Are you really that concerned about other falangs?Are you really that concerned about the falang image?How much of the reason to do this volunteer police work is because you enjoy the authority you are given?

In my home country,you have to take a psych. evaluation/interviews to become a policeman because many have the hidden power trip motives.

How emerged are you guys into the Thai society that you live in?You speak fluent Thai?I hear your comments about what great guys these Thais are,does that mean you believe they are really trustworthy,not predjudice towards falangs etc.etc.?


My reply to the answers from the TPV's:

Doc and Harry,excellent replies to my questions.I am glad to hear that both of you were involved in Law enforcement before coming here!
I have often wondered if the Thais were putting people in positions of authority without a background in law enforcement!As I see it ,that could have a negative outcome!
I definitely empathize with the feelings of doing something useful in retirement versus sitting in the pubs drinking most of the time.
If your Thai is limited ,than I assume the TP's speak adequate English for you to communicate with them.
I would like to see ,what IMO,the ''rabble'' falangs deported.I believe that as part of the visa requirements,actions determined to be detrimental to society is grounds for deportation(paraphrased)!If so ,why don't the police get a little tougher with these characters?
It sounds like both of you are doing honorable service Smile

My comments relating to one of many experiences with the regular police:
Laughing It is a different type of police here than in my country.We have to pay for them to make an ocassional passes on our soi! Rolling Eyes
Laughing Police came yesterday to collect.I felt like telling them that I didn't want the service,but changed my mind!Since I didn't initially request it ,I did go along with the neighbors and I don't want to be singled out by the police as a problem!TiT Laughing

Harry1534 said:
''I have asked the police about gangs and mafia but they only laugh and say 'no such thing'.''

My reply:
:lol:Much of the Thai mafia,in Bangkok, are groups within the police or army abusing there authority.Not to be confused with organized ''civilian'' groups!


My reply about TPV's in Nong Khai:

Laughing I am not sure,but I don't think we have tourist police.Definitely don't have any falang volunteers.


My post:


Smile I applaud those who volunteer to help others,whether it is to have something to do or for altruistic reasons.

I have psych/med background experience and I find that I am keen to situations where I might be of help,maybe more in accident situations than help in the psych area.Although I have had opportunity to be helpful in a couple of mental therapeutic situations.

Someone having a law enforcement background,has experience in handling situations that might arise within the community between falangs/ Thais and falang/falang.

I guess,I just don't have a lot of empathy or sympathy for falangs that make these kind of choices!

Laughing That attitude would probably change if I was to get stupid in some confrontational situation.Then I would be glad to see you volunteers!

I can always be grateful that we don't all think alike or experience the same feelings about given situations and individuals.So my hat is off to those that are in service to some of us that might not deserve it at the time Smile


My posts related to questions about WP's:

Laughing Since volunteer work is illegal,do they give you a work permit?Can you actually do volunteer work on a retirement visa? Confused

Jimbo,I didn't see anything on the site that clarified my question about T.P.'s needing work permits or not.And if they are given work permits,do they have to meet any of the monetary requirements imposed on retired or married expats?

I don't see how a person that has a visa stamped retired,can get a work permit.Seems to me ,legally speaking,volunteer ''work'' is ruled out in that situation!If that is true,some T.P. volunteers could actually be breaking the law Yikes

I think the visa only allows entry into the country.The work permit is for approved work whether paid or volunteer work.Maybe one can get a visa for tourist police volunteer work!If so,I wonder how many of the volunteers are doing it for the visa?

I think the retired stamped visa rules out ALL work , volunteered or paid!
Laughing Of course,they would not enforce the law in an area that is of benefit to them Laughing I was wondering if a falang could get a visa and WP to be a TP volunteer?Could be an interesting option!What do you think? Wink

So doc,unless you see something I don't,I don't understand your comment!

Nor do I understand your constant criticism of my feelings and experience with Thais and Thailand in general!They are true experiences that I share with others.I point out negatives to be of help to other falangs.I complain about things that affect my family and myself which I think is healthy and warranted!I like many things about Thailand!That is why I have lived here for 8 years continuosly!I don't believe that I have to respect ALL the customs and culture of Thailand to live here.I enjoy my life here and one of the reasons is that I am able to accept the customs and culture for what they are in relationship to me as a falang,not wearing any ''rose tinted glasses''!
Yes,I do believe that,in general, Thailand is anti-falang!If you don't,why don't you explain why,rather than constantly criticise my feelings and opinions??
IMO,you criticise and needle to get pleasure for yourself!After awhile,when you get criticised back,you turn it around as personal attacks unwarranted,when in fact you are the attacker with your sly remarks and ''superior wordsmithing''!
Your comments about ''others'',you talk to about me,negative feelings about me are not a surprise!There are always people that dislike someone that disagrees with them!I would be surprised if it were very many as you insinuate!I think most of the members of this forum are above those kinds of feelings and thoughts!
In that light,I can honestly say that I have never heard your name brought up in a positive way,amongst board members I have talked to in person,not once!!Not that all have chosen to make any comment,those that do,ALL NEGATIVE!!

Your comment about me having a different personality on the forum than in person is ridiculous!You met me one time at the Irish Clock!I was friendly acting even though I thought you were an obnoxious antagonistic loudmouth at the time.Nothing about your posts has changed my opinion of you!I was polite and quickly left your presence!
As far as me being ''an insecure pissant'' and your insinuation that I am a coward to face you in person,I will say this:
I will never ''come'' to talk with you nor do I look forward to ''bumping into''you in Udon!
If you want to ''talk''in person to me,or ''anything else'' in person,you can come to Nong Khai or seek me out when I am in Udon,it would be ''my pleasure''to accomodate you!

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Post by banpaeng » June 14, 2007, 8:31 am

I am going to lock this thread and ask Lee to delete it. Looks like most forum rules were broke by all. At the least agree to disagree and move on.

If you guys can not be nice or at least be civil then don't post.

Locked

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