Native English teacher problems the current scenario

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Khun Paul
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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Khun Paul » March 14, 2015, 5:57 pm

As i understand it the current situation has been brought about, because of the new guidelines issued by the Thai Ministry of Education regarding special courses for native English Speakers, plus the insistence of no more than a specifi amount of letters issued for one person.
The fact that there has been since may last year NO courses open for native speakers to attain the necessary is of course irrelevant
Soem of this information has been gleaned from many sources, but the fact some schools in Udon do not have a single native English Speaker under contract for the next academic year is very unusual.

So we now have a Mexican stand-off,
1. The Thai Immigration is insisting on various documents before processing any Visas for Teachers.
2. The Thai Government Teachers Council is not issuing letters due to a myriad of reasons
3 Schools do not have native Eng;lish teachers under contract yet for next year
4, Native English teachers are getting very very angry, fed up and thinking of what they have to do to even stay in this country.
5 if schools wish to source new teachers to get around the impasse, there are NOT enough looking , to fill quotas. Plus many schools are implementing English programmes to fill the glaring gap in the knowledge of English in the Sciences and Maths. So if they didn't have enough now they certainly wont have come the 1st of April and that is NO April Fools Joke this folks is reality.

Remember what they used to say during the 60's/ 70's if war broke out, put your head between your legs and **** **** **** goodbye.

Well this is similar situation it is a no win scenario , aided and abetted by the Thai Govt, Thai Ministry of Education and in a small part by the Schools . Losers are Children and Native English teachers.
The saddest part is that I do not think for one minute that anyone in the Thai Govt gives a **** !

PS:- This although may apply to me, but it in noway meant as a moan, just an observation for all with children at schools.



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old-timer
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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by old-timer » March 14, 2015, 6:06 pm

So does this mean you have to give up teaching in Udon Khun Paul? Or are you saying that the schools cannot take on new English teachers although they need them? Or both.

OT....................... \:D/

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can123
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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by can123 » March 14, 2015, 6:52 pm

Khun Paul, are you saying that graduates with CELTA qualification are not being recruited these days ? Being a native speaker is certainly not a guarantee of being able to tech the language and if efforts are being made to rid Thailand of the "Mickey Mousers" who think they can teach without being qualified, I for one will applaud them.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Khun Paul » March 14, 2015, 7:11 pm

I am not saying anything, there is a TCT council in Bangkok which issues temp licences to teach , for years this has been an ad hoc sort of arrangement and most got these letters. Now it seems following an insistence that foreign teachers need a course in understanding Thai schools/children etc including the psychology of same then the lines have been drawn. They appear to be tightening the rules of issuing these temp licences and the number an individual can get, they are insisting on this course within a specific time frame, but they are not providing the courses to attend, they did with a stroke of a pen, cancel anyone who had previously taken part of the course soi we all have to start again.
New teachers could get a temp licence but with the pay up here being so much lower than other parts of Thailand there is almost no incentive for foreign teachers to fork out the dosh to get the qualification let alone being able to live here as well . Universities and colleges of course do not need this letter , this requirement for this qualification is only for Junior and senior schools .
I knew about the course and qualification and was waiting the the implementation of the new place to attend to gain said qual, as outlined by the Minister so we could all go along, but of course there are not any new places anywhere.
So in almost one stroke of a pen, schools in Issan are not being able to retain their current teachers, there is a lack of new blood ( teachers ) seeking employment and with the inability of schools to retain what they have, the numbers required outweigh the numbers looking considerably, let me talk about schools I personally know .

The numbers required IF unable to retain current teaching staff is in excess of 30- to 40 that is just a few schools. trust me they are not out there looking for jobs. maybe half a dozen but not the numbers needed. it is no wonder the schools are pulling out their hair.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by dtammakhung » March 14, 2015, 7:29 pm

I think this means Thailand prefers Philipino teachers. Philipino teachers are qualified to teach. Very few farang are qualified to teach. There has been a long trend to non native sspeakers to teach. It's their country and have the right to do as they please. Also Thailand tends to prefer farang just off the boat to those who've been here too long and should have gone home long ago.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Dreamcatcher » March 14, 2015, 7:39 pm

can123 wrote:Being a native speaker is certainly not a guarantee of being able to tech the language and if efforts are being made to rid Thailand of the "Mickey Mousers" who think they can teach without being qualified, I for one will applaud them.
I totally, agree C123! The selection and approval process for teacher's have to be stringent. Though for those that truly qualifies, their visa and work permit approvals has to be eased up.

Just being a 'Native English Speaker' doesn't necessarily qualifies teaching the language.

In my short 6 years (well...almost), I'm saddened and horrified to have met way too many 'Native English Speaker' teaching in schools both public and private when they were the one's that ought to still be learning.

I'm not a paragon of the English vernacular, but suffice to say, able to identify bad English when it's spoken.

IMHO, it's better with the shortage than aplenty that would only serves to be detrimental in the long run.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by MrFixer » March 14, 2015, 7:57 pm

I guess Thailand considers native English speakers a necessary evil - and maybe now unnecessary (to be replaced with Filipinos and Africans)? I have no experience of teaching in Thailand but I've heard that salaries have not increased for about 20 years. Goodness knows how little government schools in Udon must pay - can only be beer money? I can't imagine anyone who is properly qualified wanting to do it when there are so many better options in Asia.
If you are NES and can teach to degree level then certain Chinese universities will pay 1000GBP a week, plus flight and accommodation to teach on their 'international' courses.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Khun Paul » March 14, 2015, 8:40 pm

To clarify a misconception, most teachers I know have the necessary qualifications a TEFLl AND a BA in a field some even have a BA in English and, also to make a point Philipino teachers ALSO need to attend a course to get qualified.
Even Thai teachers need a licence and many do not have but as they are Thai not a real problem.

It is not the question of teachers NOT being qualified it is the case of the tighening of some rules which were there before and the NEW requirement which going by a course being run for Philipino teachers is in total about 50k which includes stays every weekend in BKK,

Thailand does not i think like having to rely on any fgoreign teachers to teach their children anything, but as their foreign language skills are BAD if they do not have them the Thai youth will be the losers, and thailand as a whole but then that is logical thinking .

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by DRILLER » March 15, 2015, 6:54 pm

if only the so called authorities looked past the piece of paper the philippines degree is written & they would discover most philippinos got their degrees the philippino way. :^o :^o :^o :^o :^o :^o

paying less renumeration is most desirable.

the africans =P~ =P~ =P~ =P~
temptation is a ****

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Khun Paul
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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Khun Paul » March 15, 2015, 8:12 pm

Just had an update from a colleague there is a course available in Bangkok but it requires a minimum of 7 flights to and from bangkok, 14 nights in total ion Bkk, plus cse fee, you lot do the maths, if the schools do not poay it, not one teacher will that I am sure about min cost without Cse fee is approx 15000 plus .

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Dreamcatcher » March 16, 2015, 10:09 am

Philippine awarded degrees/Western degrees and whatever degrees from wherever all fell into one basket called, 'worthless'.

If those that possesses it do not qualify to teach English as it should be, then better to do without them.

I do emphatize with Khun Paul's concern and over the future of Thai youth, though.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by can123 » March 16, 2015, 5:46 pm

I am fully qualified and taught English in an International School, and worked for two language schools in Pattaya. I earned a total of about 40000 baht per month and thoroughly enjoyed my life. I had savings so my earnings were relatively unimportant but I had a comfortable lifestyle with my salary.

The problem was that I often worked alongside people who could speak English, had no qualifications and could not teach properly. The Thais were happy to pay these clowns and the result was that qualified teachers' salaries were depressed and the kids learned nothing. The Thai teachers' English skills were dreadful beyond belief. I know of a Principal in one International School in Pattaya who could barely say "Good Morning" in English and a headmaster whose qualifications were all thanks to Photoshop. He didn't even have O-Levels !

We tried our hardest to teach the children but it was very demoralising. My best students were hotel receptionists who wished to speak English properly. These girls worked really hard and it was a pleasure to teach them.

I doubt that I will ever teach English again as the whole system is corrupt and it really didn't matter if I was a good teacher or a bad one. Obviously, I feel better by having tried my best but teaching English in Thailand is not a career I would urge others to pursue.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by glalt » March 16, 2015, 8:58 pm

The students here in the boonies of Loei province don't have a chance of learning English. A friend of mine and myself are both native speakers and were asked to teach at least part time. I declined immediately because I am a crotchety old fart and have no patience for children. My friend likes kids and was interviewed by the schools Thai English teacher. The English teacher spoke atrocious English and couldn't explain to my friend what the job description was. The Thai teacher gave my friend a contract to sign and couldn't explain what the contract said. Of course my friend declined and that was the end of that. Neither myself or my friend are qualified to teach. The school ended up hiring two black Africans. They both spoke French but their English was very bad. They were fired a couple months later.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by jackspratt » March 16, 2015, 9:40 pm

glalt wrote:The school ended up hiring two black Africans. They both spoke French but their English was very bad. They were fired a couple months later.
What was the significance of their skin colour? :-k

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Laan Yaa Mo » March 16, 2015, 9:51 pm

What else could it be but to demonstrate that unlike Europeans, Thais do not discriminate in their hiring process.
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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by bignote1 » March 16, 2015, 11:43 pm

jackspratt wrote:What was the significance of their skin colour? :-k
Very significant for colour blind people I would have thought.
;)

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by can123 » March 16, 2015, 11:58 pm

glalt wrote:The students here in the boonies of Loei province don't have a chance of learning English. A friend of mine and myself are both native speakers and were asked to teach at least part time. I declined immediately because I am a crotchety old fart and have no patience for children. My friend likes kids and was interviewed by the schools Thai English teacher. The English teacher spoke atrocious English and couldn't explain to my friend what the job description was. The Thai teacher gave my friend a contract to sign and couldn't explain what the contract said. Of course my friend declined and that was the end of that. Neither myself or my friend are qualified to teach. The school ended up hiring two black Africans. They both spoke French but their English was very bad. They were fired a couple months later.
The awful reality is that even those who can afford to pay for International School education fail to learn English unless they are in contact with it outside the school. I taught English to the son of a famous Thai singer and he was a good student because he had learned a great deal by being in the company of other English speakers on a daily basis. I cannot begin to tell you just how bad the Thai teachers were. Their accents made them unintelligible to most people. I have very few gifts but one is the ability to decipher accents of all kinds so I could understand the Thai teachers but nobody else could. It was an impossibility for the kids to learn English but, because these children would rather mess about in class rather than work, it didn't matter. All the kids passed all the exams anyway regardless of how they performed, they took their certificates home to their proud parents and I just squirmed.

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Native English teacher problems the current scenario

Post by Khun Paul » March 17, 2015, 3:19 am

I recently had an upate from a friend of mine regarding English being taught in Thailand, it would seem, although there is little evidence that Thailand really wants it own teachers ( Thai ) to teach English, this was translated by a friends Thai wife who was listening to the news.
Now al;though one can understand the Thai Govt's viewpoint , it is as always a knee-jerk reaction to a situation that has been known about for years, and especially since ASEAN, rules that English would be the lingua franca of business and commerce in ASEAN. The end of this year will see AEC implemented across the board and Thailand unfortunately will be unable to stop the rot as citizens from across ASEAN can move and work fairly freely, true it is expected that Thailand as with other nations will seek to prevent some jobs going to non-thais, as will many other countries being protective of their own populations.But as with the EEC in Europe it will happen here, and deep down Thailand knows that its poorly educated workforce will be at a distinct disadvantage, many teachers have spoken about this for years, but as per usual it was ignored by the Bangkok mandarins in Govt and yet now with the date looming they are panicking and making it so hard for their children to get a decent education and obtain language skills that one can almost see the decline in Thailand. lets look at the facts, they are having to recruit almost One MILLION workers to fill their skills gap. They are unable to supply bi-lingual staff for many major international companies , they are considered ( quote from my friend in Singapore ) considered the worst educated population ( in percentage terms ) in ASEAN ranking below that of even Laos.

Why one should ask, Corruption/ Culture and Thainess springs to mind there are other reasons, the No Fail policy which permeates even to University degrees is one of the major cause, the children KNOW full well that they will progress and pass even if they are illiterate, so why bother learning. Boys inherit whereas girls still considered a cash cow.

We all know this and try to make a DIFFERENCE , now with the current cock-up at Khurusapha in Bangkok , it does make one think why bother and just retire and teach privately so those that want to learn can the rest, are in the hands of the incompetent lead by the uneducated and the uncaring and the ones that suffer are the children. Who are our future, fail them we fail ourselves

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