Brexit and Leadership.

[Zico]

Sorry about earlier, strong on sentiment but poor on factual reasoning, a bit like Brexit.

Whatever pension you pay into is reliant on the efforts of the people who are working now to pay you back as a recipient. If people stop paying in, you don't get paid and the whole scheme collapses. Pensions are really a huge ponzi scheme designed by the baby boomer generation to line their own pockets in retirement.

Any Gen X or Millennial with a basic understanding of finance would invest in shares or buy property rather than buy into a pension fund they could be locked into with limited returns and the potential to go bust due to mismanagement and Brexit.

At some point the pension bomb will go off and general tax payers will have to pick up the tab.It won't be pleasant as workers will have to pay higher taxes to fund pensioner holidays... they earned it right.

If populism is still in vogue older people could be in real trouble.

[Zico]

BoJo is great.

He's a posh every man with a nationalistic swagger.

The Guinness drinkers Farrage.

[vincemunday]

Some of us were lucky enough to sign up for pensions a long, long time ago with guaranteed income/rates. Of course some people have a portfolio of property, pensions and various other instruments, it's impossible to tar everyone with the same brush, as my dear old mum used to say "never put all your eggs in one basket". The pension ponzi scheme will have to fail, people are living far longer and the biggest area of growth in the population isn't necessarily happening among those who have highest employment rates. At some point, making people work longer isn't going to work, I think 70 for both sexes is the government target, women are already griping that they cant retire at 60, heaven knows what they'll be like if it hits 70. We also have the issue of a huge influx of immigrants who will qualify for a pension and the vast majority of those won't have been contributing as long as those who started work here in their early 20's. Of course the solution is to make people pay more for their retirement, make them pay more and more into pension schemes, that's going to upset the apple cart too. Bojo is a mug, he makes far too many mistakes and he's lost his popularity among grass roots conservatives, I think you stand more chance of seeing Javid or Mogg at the helm. By the by its Farage not Farrage and he's missed his window of opportunity too.

[Zico]

Some of us were lucky enough to sign up for pensions a long, long time ago with guaranteed income/rates. Of course some people have a portfolio of property, pensions and various other instruments, it's impossible to tar everyone with the same brush, as my dear old mum used to say "never put all your eggs in one basket". The pension ponzi scheme will have to fail, people are living far longer and the biggest area of growth in the population isn't necessarily happening among those who have highest employment rates. At some point, making people work longer isn't going to work, I think 70 for both sexes is the government target, women are already griping that they cant retire at 60, heaven knows what they'll be like if it hits 70. We also have the issue of a huge influx of immigrants who will qualify for a pension and the vast majority of those won't have been contributing as long as those who started work here in their early 20's. Of course the solution is to make people pay more for their retirement, make them pay more and more into pension schemes, that's going to upset the apple cart too. Bojo is a mug, he makes far too many mistakes and he's lost his popularity among grass roots conservatives, I think you stand more chance of seeing Javid or Mogg at the helm. By the by its Farage not Farrage and he's missed his window of opportunity too.

Vince I don't doubt you were once a smart guy, maybe still to some extent if you're not only relying on a pension fund to live off in your old age.

But Brexit..

You're an idiot.

I'm not keen on 'furenurs' talking funny to each other and wearing weird clothes while I'm trying to go about my business but.. they are doing jobs that make my job possible, and yours if you had one in the EU/UK. They fill the pensions black hole for now too.

East Europeans are awesome workers and great for a bit of socialising when you get to know them. (the ladies are unreal)
I'd rather them than the alternative which will be shipped in x10 as part off a trade deal by Priti Patel with 'emerging markets'.

To shore up statistic's they'll make it harder for dependants of ex-pats in other places, like Thailand, to get into the UK.

[Zico]

I think Brexit was a protest vote against 'the establishment'. How else do you explain Sunderland voting to make their biggest employer, Nissan, leave?

There needs to be another vote with three options, Deal, No Deal, Stay. The Leaver vote is split between morons and nationalists so stay would likely win. Happy Days

[vincemunday]

I have no objections to anyone working in the UK Eastern or Western as long as they assimilate, and work hard.

My main business was far more international than depending on local employees of any description, our main business came out of the US, Hong Kong, Singapore, Japan, Russia etc as well as the European countries. I've definitely no issue with Eastern Europeans, I've employed Polish, Lithuanians and Czechs when we had our catering business and found them to be very hard working, reliable people, far more reliable than British to be fair. Brexit isn't just about immigration, it's about sovereignty and self determination as well, i think the European bloc will slowly fall apart and I think we're just getting out sooner rather than later, the Southern European countries have had it hard, some might think the wealth should have been shared around a bit more. People are just getting their heads around a Canadian +++ style deal, something Farage et al have been asking for, for a while, imo its the best solution and WTO rules are nothing to fear.

[vincemunday]

There'll be no new vote.

[Zico]

I have no objections to anyone working in the UK Eastern or Western as long as they assimilate, and work hard.

My main business was far more international than depending on local employees of any description, our main business came out of the US, Hong Kong, Singapore, Japan, Russia etc as well as the European countries. I've definitely no issue with Eastern Europeans, I've employed Polish, Lithuanians and Czechs when we had our catering business and found them to be very hard working, reliable people, far more reliable than British to be fair. Brexit isn't just about immigration, it's about sovereignty and self determination as well, i think the European bloc will slowly fall apart and I think we're just getting out sooner rather than later, the Southern European countries have had it hard, some might think the wealth should have been shared around a bit more. People are just getting their heads around a Canadian +++ style deal, something Farage et al have been asking for, for a while, imo its the best solution and WTO rules are nothing to fear.

=D>

Brexit is about many things to many people, sovereignty is probably the worst and most misguided. North Korea is the most sovereign nation on earth these days because it is so isolated. If you trade you have to compromise something and the more you trade the more you compromise.

The EU eliminates 'unelected bureaucrats and red tape' completely opposite to what Farrage and his Daily Mail jingoistic band wagon spout. The EU is really good for business, that's why Corbyn hates it.

There has to be a vote either in parliament on another referendum to get Brexit done. I hope by then most rational Brexiters have got the tantrum out of their system and we can go back to being the best golf team in the world.

[Zico]

There'll be no new vote.

There has to be a confirmation of the final outcome, either in parliament or by plebiscite. The EU won't commit to an agreement on anything with a UK government which could collapse at any time.

[vincemunday]

Come what may we leave the EU on March 29, 2019, the EU have already made it quite clear that there will be no extension. What there might be is a final vote on the deal we have or haven't agreed. My guess is we are being readied for no deal which is why the EU is now pushing us towards a Canadian style deal, we will see.

[Giggle]

Just as Dr. Faustus learned, when you make a pact with the devil, you can't back out when the going gets rough, or if you have a change of heart. Britain's tryst with the EU lasted 40 years while Faust only enjoyed 24 years of magical reign, with Mephistopheles as his personal servant. Faustus, like Britain, failed to see the warnings and ignored their implications. At the 11th hour, Faustus tried to repent and beg for mercy, to no avail -- he had sold his soul to Lucifer. Similarly, Britain finds itself trying to back out of a deal it joined willingly and enthusiastically.

Marlowe's take on the German legend is prophetic; a pound of flesh will be the levy. The devils will "tear it asunder."

[GT93]

This is all becoming a lesson in how not to Brexit. Hopefully the next country going out the door has an easier path.