Plumbing question

[stattointhailand]

I admit to having no knowledge whatsoever, but am struggling to understand a problem. I have a large water tank fed from the mains. About 12 years ago I got fed up opening and closing the valve to fill the tank so installed a ball cock to cut off the water supply when the tank was full. This worked well for about 8 years or so and then it failed and the water level rose to the top and subsequently flowed out of the tank via the lid opening After replacing the faulty ball cock every thing was great until about 2 months ago when my bill rose from the usual B90 to B400 and then last month B700. Having called the water co and waited over a week their rep has just come and checked the meter (everything ok there), he then looked round the house and came to the conclusion that the ball cock was the problem. Mrs Statts relayed the conclusion to me and I suggested that I didnt think it could be as the tank has not overflowed even when we were away for 24 hrs. The water co guy could not come up with a reason that the tank hadnt overflowed and stuck with his theory (backed up of course by every Thai in the group). I admit to not having a plumbing knowledge so could someone please explain to me why the tank hasnt overflowed if the ball cock is faulty. My personal theory is a leak in an underground pipe somewhere but then again I'm just a stupid farang

[pf-flyer]

I had a similar situation only it was my water pump that was regularly running when no water was being used. It turned out to be a cracked pipe. I discovered it when I investigated a damp spot in the ground. I have a suggestion. Turn off the water feeding your tank. Make sure that no water is being used during this time. Take a reading on your water meter and then take another reading an hour or so later. If you notice any increase on the second water meter reading then you do have a leak somewhere that needs to be taken care of.
I would also check the float valve in your water tank and in your bathroom toilets. The black alleges will build up everywhere there is water. It built up in my water pump and collected on the foot valve and the foot valve would not seat properly which caused the pump to run often. I disassembled the pump and cleaned the pump housing assembly and the crud off of the foot valve. Reassembled the pump and everything worked fine.

[stattointhailand]

Thnks pf, matey boy from water co disconnected the meter and ran it through a "test system" to confirm that end was OK and said that there couldnt be a leak inside the house (nothing moving when pump idle) so that means it has to be between the meter and the tank. It may be the ball cock but I just cant get my head round why the tank does not overfill if the ball cock doesnt stop the water

[davecryan]

Hi. I had this problem for many years. Pump running when nothing was turned on and water level reducing in tank. Noticed a damp patch between tank and house,had it excavated and found a cracked pipe. Had the section cut out and replaced...problem solved. The cracked pipe was the feed pipe from tank to cold water tap under the sink.

[BillaRickaDickay]

That's a massive jump in consumption, as suggested sounds like a leak between the meter and the tank or your neighbour has secretly taken a spur off of your feed.

[RLTrader]

Yes sounds like a leak between meter and tank. Few years ago had same problem, checked ground for wet spot, mine easy to find, had puddle.
I keep the fill to tank closed, and wife opens for a few hours in early morn, for had same problem with it not shutting off, think I have replaced twice in 10+ years, and this one I think needs replacing. Water here seems to rot everything.

After the pump I have a shut off to house, so if I shut off and pump still runs, it a pump problem. After a hour or so and turn back on without having used house water, and pump runs, then house leak.

When I build, didn't think it was for 10+ years. If I had would have done water different, some how. Costly to tear up concrete. Presently have leaky Hot water to 1 shower, so it needs to be shut off after use. Slight pain.

[glalt]

I'd say that it's pretty obvious that you have a leak somewhere. The water meter doesn't run unless there is water actually going through it. By the same token, when or if water is back feeding, the meter will run backwards. I know this because we had a leak in front of the meter. The guy who repaired the leak re-installed the meter backwards. The next time the meter was read the village owed us money. That problem was quickly fixed. We did go ahead and pay the normal rate that we had been paying.

[bluejets]

By the same token, when or if water is back feeding, the meter will run backwards.

No one way valves used there..?

[RLTrader]

By the same token, when or if water is back feeding, the meter will run backwards.

No one way valves used there..?

When I first set up water supply had a nice brass one way valve. Woke up one morn and found that the neighborhood got hit and all the brass fitting were gone. Needless to say didn't install another one, and I think I have one in my parts cabinet. If I remember right was thinking of using on inside the wall, but never got around to it.

[saint]

Any luck finding the leak yet Statts ?
I agree with most that it can only be a leak between the meter and ball valve , if the tank does not overflow.
However you may well not see a wet patch on the ground , if there has been the slightest ground subsidence below the pipe , and its moved the pipe . The water would run into a hole under the surface , and the longer it runs the greater the eventual hole .
Some housing complexes , never bothered to compact the fill on development , and dumped all sorts of rubbish in there , and just a bit of soil , say i metre on top of that .
The crap compacts over the years and you end up with a void .

[stattointhailand]

Thanks for the comments guys.
In the interest of "harmony", I will replace the ball valve tomorrow (worth it just to save my ears) before starting on a leak hunt. Havent seen anything that looked like a wet patch in the garden but search not helped by yesterdays downpours

[parrot]

Many moons ago, an American friend of ours received a water bill for several thousand baht. Impossible, he told the water office. They checked and said he was responsible. A relative finally uncovered the leak, under the house and, indeed, the water was running into a void in the ground.
As for what's underneath a house in Udon......near the airport there's a housing development built on top of tons and tons of discarded cement. The builder set a not-so-thick layer of soil on top before building. My wife and I have often wondered how those houses are holding up. t.i.t.

[BillaRickaDickay]

Sounds a bit Ott for no1 step of investigation, if you tie up your ball valve with a piece of string so it's closed and then run a tap in the house for a few minutes you will soon see if you have a leaky ball valve, as you said before if it was a leaky valve the water would overflow from the tank. Maybe you have split tank.
To eliminate pipe from meter to tank, cut pipe at meter and before tank and fit an overground hosepipe, check for any improvement.
If no change its a faulty meter or the leak is house side of the tank.

[RLTrader]

Thanks for the comments guys.
In the interest of "harmony", I will replace the ball valve tomorrow (worth it just to save my ears) before starting on a leak hunt. Havent seen anything that looked like a wet patch in the garden but search not helped by yesterdays downpours

Do you have a shut off before it enters Tank? If not, an easy investment of about 50฿ for shut off and another 50฿ for glue, and maybe 25฿ for a saw blade.

Dam if you open the top you should be able to see if its off
Just a thought
In the interest of "harmony"? unheard of on this site.

[glalt]

As a side note, We had a cobra problem. Killed three of them within about five months. I did a serious hunt to see if I could possibly find somewhere where they could be coming from. Beside the house, I found a hole that was about 4 inches in diameter. I stuck the hose in it and turned on the water. I watched the hole for a while and nothing came out and the hole never filled up. I left the water run for more than 6 hours and that hole never did fill up. I covered the hole with chunks of broken concrete.

I mention this because leaks can be difficult to find. I have no idea where all that water went.

[RLTrader]

I mention this because leaks can be difficult to find. I have no idea where all that water went.

Don't know his site, but if like mine and many others the water PVC pipe going to the tank is maybe 20M long and only buried maybe 20C. Doesn't take much to dig up and check. Should be able to find someone in the area to do the job for very little ฿ and if leak is found fix. Of course mine is grass, if small plot and all concrete, could do like my neighbor did, he ran a new line on top wall.

[tamada]

...
As for what's underneath a house in Udon......near the airport there's a housing development built on top of tons and tons of discarded cement. The builder set a not-so-thick layer of soil on top before building. My wife and I have often wondered how those houses are holding up. t.i.t.

Just another shameless un-naming of the aforementioned 'housing development' IMHO.

[stattointhailand]

"In the interest of "harmony"? unheard of on this site. "

Not met Mrs Statts when she hs a bee in her bonnet then RL

B250 for a new ball cock is cheaper than the medical bills involved after i've bashed me 'ed on a brick wll for 30 mins

The guy from Water co told her (and local neighbour) it was the ball valve at fault so NO AMOUNT of common sense was ever going to win that argument

[parrot]

...
As for what's underneath a house in Udon......near the airport there's a housing development built on top of tons and tons of discarded cement. The builder set a not-so-thick layer of soil on top before building. My wife and I have often wondered how those houses are holding up. t.i.t.

Just another shameless un-naming of the aforementioned 'housing development' IMHO.

Thanarung Village บ้านธนะรุ่ง

[RLTrader]

Not met Mrs Statts when she hs a bee in her bonnet then RL

B250 for a new ball cock is cheaper than the medical bills involved after i've bashed me 'ed on a brick wll for 30 mins

The guy from Water co told her (and local neighbour) it was the ball valve at fault so NO AMOUNT of common sense was ever going to win that argument

good one

Might want to ask her, if doesn't fix water bill problem will she be paying.