The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

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tamada
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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by tamada » January 19, 2020, 12:39 am

joudon wrote:
January 18, 2020, 10:38 am
I gather that you do not really like Trump.
Is it really pertinent if I like Trump or not? Is it important to know if ANYONE likes him or otherwise? To be honest, it is largely irrelevant to me but my opinion is that America had Hobson's choice between Clinton in Trump and made the best of a bad bunch on election day. Subsequently, because of the way he personally and his ever-changing, revolving-door administration has evolved over his first term in office, the only real positive I see is that he has made a steadily increasing amount of Americans look good. I am not talking about those who voted for him or have subscribed to his unique brand of being Presidential either.

I will let you work out if that's a compliment or otherwise.
Kenr6583 wrote:
January 18, 2020, 7:27 pm
I guess the last three Presidents, Clinton, Bush, and Obama, they had it made, everything was just rosy during their presidencies. There was no bickering, no fighting, and everyone got along just swell. The Republicans respected Clinton and Obama, respected their ideas and helped them get all their agendas implemented, and the Democrats did the same for Bush. But poor Trump is the victim here because he's the first POTUS in the history where the opposing party didn't respect his position.
He's a victim of his own boorishness and vanity. The 'never Trumpers' and 'Trump haters' are inventions of DJT to bolster his need to be seen as someone who achieves great things when faced with all sorts of adversity. His acolytes only serve to propagate this myth about his great leadership.



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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by jai yen yen » January 19, 2020, 12:56 am

Trump is not a politician which is a good thing in my opinion. Politicians are generally careful what they say, go with the flow, look after each other and play the game with their priority to get reelected. Trump has rocked everyones boat because he is none of those things. if anyone looked honestly at the facts it is obvious he has done a great deal for the U.S.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by Kenr6583 » January 19, 2020, 1:46 am

jai yen yen wrote:
January 19, 2020, 12:56 am
Trump is not a politician which is a good thing in my opinion. Politicians are generally careful what they say, go with the flow, look after each other and play the game with their priority to get reelected. Trump has rocked everyones boat because he is none of those things. if anyone looked honestly at the facts it is obvious he has done a great deal for the U.S.
But in all honesty you can make any economy look good by running a 1 trillion dollar deficit year after year. The national debt is now over 23 trillion dollars, and this should not be happening if the economy is truly that great.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by tamada » January 19, 2020, 6:06 am

jai yen yen wrote:
January 19, 2020, 12:56 am
Trump is not a politician which is a good thing in my opinion. Politicians are generally careful what they say, go with the flow, look after each other and play the game with their priority to get reelected. Trump has rocked everyones boat because he is none of those things. if anyone looked honestly at the facts it is obvious he has done a great deal for the U.S.
If Trump is not a politician as you claim, why is he is hell-bent on looking after his own, playing the game and being re-elected?

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by ladda3904 » January 19, 2020, 8:59 am

tamada wrote:
January 19, 2020, 6:06 am
jai yen yen wrote:
January 19, 2020, 12:56 am
Trump is not a politician which is a good thing in my opinion. Politicians are generally careful what they say, go with the flow, look after each other and play the game with their priority to get reelected. Trump has rocked everyones boat because he is none of those things. if anyone looked honestly at the facts it is obvious he has done a great deal for the U.S.
If Trump is not a politician as you claim, why is he is hell-bent on looking after his own, playing the game and being re-elected?
Could it be Trump knows how much ex presidents are worth?

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by Kenr6583 » January 19, 2020, 9:08 am

ladda3904 wrote:
January 19, 2020, 8:59 am
tamada wrote:
January 19, 2020, 6:06 am
jai yen yen wrote:
January 19, 2020, 12:56 am
Trump is not a politician which is a good thing in my opinion. Politicians are generally careful what they say, go with the flow, look after each other and play the game with their priority to get reelected. Trump has rocked everyones boat because he is none of those things. if anyone looked honestly at the facts it is obvious he has done a great deal for the U.S.
If Trump is not a politician as you claim, why is he is hell-bent on looking after his own, playing the game and being re-elected?
Could it be Trump knows how much ex presidents are worth?
Not as much as he claims he is worth. Besides, with the tax cuts he got passed to help his businesses, and by bullying the Fed to lower interest rates to lower his loan payments, he's doing very well for himself.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by TJ » January 19, 2020, 2:11 pm

IMO the assumption that the Republicans have sufficient safe votes to avoid a conviction is by no means certain. The Demonrats have the means to turn many Republican votes to convict. They have sufficient U.S. and foreign sources to offer billions worth of bribes to dangle in front of Never Trump and greedy Republican congressmen. They also have files and databases containing evidence of criminal and damaging events that would ruin or damage the lives of Republican senators or their families.

This may be mitigated by the circumstance that though convicted President Trump may still be eligible to run for the 2020 election in which he is presently an overwhelming favorite to win. We shall see what transpires in the coming weeks.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by parrot » January 19, 2020, 2:58 pm

TJ wrote:
January 19, 2020, 2:11 pm
IMO the assumption that the Republicans have sufficient safe votes to avoid a conviction is by no means certain. The Demonrats have the means to turn many Republican votes to convict. They have sufficient U.S. and foreign sources to offer billions worth of bribes to dangle in front of Never Trump and greedy Republican congressmen. They also have files and databases containing evidence of criminal and damaging events that would ruin or damage the lives of Republican senators or their families.

This may be mitigated by the circumstance that though convicted President Trump may still be eligible to run for the 2020 election in which he is presently an overwhelming favorite to win. We shall see what transpires in the coming weeks.
I'm glad to know that. Now, if Trump is convicted by the Senate, I'll know it's because of bribes and potential Jeffrey Epstein-like evidence against the Republicans that voted to oust him.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by tamada » January 19, 2020, 5:11 pm

TJ wrote:
January 19, 2020, 2:11 pm
IMO the assumption that the Republicans have sufficient safe votes to avoid a conviction is by no means certain. The Demonrats have the means to turn many Republican votes to convict. They have sufficient U.S. and foreign sources to offer billions worth of bribes to dangle in front of Never Trump and greedy Republican congressmen. They also have files and databases containing evidence of criminal and damaging events that would ruin or damage the lives of Republican senators or their families.

This may be mitigated by the circumstance that though convicted President Trump may still be eligible to run for the 2020 election in which he is presently an overwhelming favorite to win. We shall see what transpires in the coming weeks.
If you are seriously suggesting that DJT's eventual demise could be underwritten by the dishonesty and greed of incumbent GOP senators, I guess he didn't drain that swamp that he promised us all he would do, no?

But that's only if you are seriously considering this as an excuse.

You aren't really being serious with this, "It wasn't my fault, it was those nasty, rich and influential Democrats preying on the weak-willed members of our congregation" hypothesis for failure are you?

Or is it just your own, personal squeaky bum talking?

As for your suggestion that DJT could still run for POTUS if found guilty, you haven't read or understood what one of the fundamental punishments of being found guilty of Presidential abuse of power and obstruction of justice is. He wouldn't even be eligible to run for president of his local home-owners association.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by tamada » January 19, 2020, 7:09 pm

TJ wrote:
January 19, 2020, 2:11 pm
IMO the assumption that the Republicans have sufficient safe votes to avoid a conviction is by no means certain. The Demonrats have the means to turn many Republican votes to convict. They have sufficient U.S. and foreign sources to offer billions worth of bribes to dangle in front of Never Trump and greedy Republican congressmen. They also have files and databases containing evidence of criminal and damaging events that would ruin or damage the lives of Republican senators or their families.

This may be mitigated by the circumstance that though convicted President Trump may still be eligible to run for the 2020 election in which he is presently an overwhelming favorite to win. We shall see what transpires in the coming weeks.
Since you have brought up US political toadyism and venality, here's a bit of history from a previous, failed impeachment that the current VP seems to have misappropriated in his rush to make people look the other way over DJT's impeachment. Yes, yes, I know that the right-wing will rush to shoot the messenger out of hand but the message remains resolutely couched in a rather obscure but distinctly murky bit of US Constitutional history.

Pence's outrageous op-ed holds deeper meaning

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/01/18/opin ... index.html

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by jackspratt » January 19, 2020, 7:27 pm

tamada wrote:
January 19, 2020, 5:11 pm

As for your suggestion that DJT could still run for POTUS if found guilty, you haven't read or understood what one of the fundamental punishments of being found guilty of Presidential abuse of power and obstruction of justice is. He wouldn't even be eligible to run for president of his local home-owners association.
Not so, unless a disqualification vote is carried (by simple majority) in the Senate.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by tamada » January 19, 2020, 8:42 pm

jackspratt wrote:
January 19, 2020, 7:27 pm
tamada wrote:
January 19, 2020, 5:11 pm

As for your suggestion that DJT could still run for POTUS if found guilty, you haven't read or understood what one of the fundamental punishments of being found guilty of Presidential abuse of power and obstruction of justice is. He wouldn't even be eligible to run for president of his local home-owners association.
Not so, unless a disqualification vote is carried (by simple majority) in the Senate.
Good grief! Really? After all this House and Senate malarkey, there would STILL be a simple majority vote in the Senate? Sort of like a regular court finding a guy guilty of murder but releasing him on his own recognizance and his promise that he will limit himself only to grand larceny and money laundering in the future and not murder anyone else.

Being America, the home of justice and being innocent until proven guilty, did the Framers write in an appeal procedure as well?

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by tamada » January 21, 2020, 5:24 pm

Anyway, for those of a right-wing persuasion who have swallowed the Hannity-speak that this is all about reversing the 2016 election, it aint.

In the unlikely event of DJT being found guilty, the incumbent VP would become president, all of Trump's judicial appointees would remain in office and the policies of a Pence administration would not be substantively different from those of the Trump administration. I wonder how his public rallies will go? Emotionless, thin-lipped, teleprompter yawn fests?

However, Pence would suddenly have to come up quickly with a re-election campaign and finding the 11th-hour funding for that enterprise. As noted above, through not being blessed with anything remotely close to the charisma and chutzpah befitting any person with presidential aspirations, he may have a struggle. Historical precedent indicates that he'll get the short gig but like Gerald Ford, that won't be sustainable. Just wonder who, from the current gaggle of Democrat presidential hopefuls, is going to be the next one-term wonder Jimmy Carter? Ironically, it was a debacle in Iran that ultimately sealed his fate and DJT seems intent on fomenting yet another one.

As the world turns.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by dragonz » January 21, 2020, 6:34 pm

tamada wrote:
January 21, 2020, 5:24 pm
Anyway, for those of a right-wing persuasion who have swallowed the Hannity-speak that this is all about reversing the 2016 election, it aint.

In the unlikely event of DJT being found guilty, the incumbent VP would become president, all of Trump's judicial appointees would remain in office and the policies of a Pence administration would not be substantively different from those of the Trump administration. I wonder how his public rallies will go? Emotionless, thin-lipped, teleprompter yawn fests?

However, Pence would suddenly have to come up quickly with a re-election campaign and finding the 11th-hour funding for that enterprise. As noted above, through not being blessed with anything remotely close to the charisma and chutzpah befitting any person with presidential aspirations, he may have a struggle. Historical precedent indicates that he'll get the short gig but like Gerald Ford, that won't be sustainable. Just wonder who, from the current gaggle of Democrat presidential hopefuls, is going to be the next one-term wonder Jimmy Carter? Ironically, it was a debacle in Iran that ultimately sealed his fate and DJT seems intent on fomenting yet another one.

As the world turns.
if it is not about overturning the 2016 election , why were they talking about impeaching him before he was sworn in or had done anything wrong . 100 % its about overturning the 2016 election . the whole world knows that

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by jackspratt » January 21, 2020, 9:19 pm

dragonz wrote:
January 21, 2020, 6:34 pm

if it is not about overturning the 2016 election , why were they talking about impeaching him before he was sworn in or had done anything wrong . 100 % its about overturning the 2016 election . the whole world knows that
No, the whole world doesn't.
Across the 33 countries surveyed by the non-partisan Washington-based think tank, a median of 64% said they do not have confidence in Trump to do the right thing in world affairs, while just 29% expressed confidence in the American leader.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/07/trumps- ... liked.html
But he probably retains confidence in the extreme, top right hand corner of the world.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by Stantheman » January 21, 2020, 11:28 pm

jackspratt wrote:
January 21, 2020, 9:19 pm
dragonz wrote:
January 21, 2020, 6:34 pm

if it is not about overturning the 2016 election , why were they talking about impeaching him before he was sworn in or had done anything wrong . 100 % its about overturning the 2016 election . the whole world knows that
No, the whole world doesn't.
Across the 33 countries surveyed by the non-partisan Washington-based think tank, a median of 64% said they do not have confidence in Trump to do the right thing in world affairs, while just 29% expressed confidence in the American leader.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/01/07/trumps- ... liked.html
But he probably retains confidence in the extreme, top right hand corner of the world.
Last I heard no corners as world is round, unless they flattened it lately.
As for the Trumpster, agree with the 64%. All he cares about is himself and his good image, in his own mind.
Last edited by Stantheman on January 22, 2020, 1:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by jai yen yen » January 22, 2020, 12:15 am

The dems know they can't beat him, the Russia hoax was a failure. Just a waste of millions of dollars and a few years time. Trump has hammered out better trade deals with Canada, Mexico and now China. The unemployment rate is the lowest it has been in nearly 50 years i believe. More companies are returning to the U.S. He has and is trying to bring more troops home from the middle east. Trump has the support of many and will win again, this is the reason for the phony impeachment attempt. For all you delicate individuals out there who are offended by the way he does things try to put your hurt feelings aside and look at the facts.

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by Doodoo » January 22, 2020, 4:06 am

"Trying to bring home more troops?"
https://truthout.org/articles/trump-bri ... e-to-iraq/
and
https://www.truthdig.com/articles/trump ... ast-again/

Best to have a read first

Trump has hammered out Trade deals with China, YES but is it better , only time will tell
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/20 ... 518435002/

"For all you delicate individuals out there who are offended by the way he does things try to put your hurt feelings aside and look at the facts."
My feelings are not hurt at all and I am certainly not a delicate individual. I for one do look at the facts and dont live on HYPE, Make America Great Again and now Keep America Great.

Then the dishwasher and shower head issue, really

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by Doodoo » January 22, 2020, 4:14 am

Just reported this morning
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-colu ... SKBN1ZK07T


China are indicating they cannot meet the absurd targets in the new Trade agreement

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Re: The Historic Impeachment Trial of Trump

Post by jai yen yen » January 22, 2020, 5:57 am

Doodoo wrote:
January 22, 2020, 4:14 am
Just reported this morning
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-colu ... SKBN1ZK07T


China are indicating they cannot meet the absurd targets in the new Trade agreement
That article is the opinion of a columnist, not China. it states so right at the beginning. Like a bellybutton, everyone has one.

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