No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

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semperfiguy
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No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by semperfiguy » May 5, 2020, 10:08 pm

If I'm reading this correctly, if you are a US citizen with a valid SS number and file a joint tax return with your wife who is a foreign national who uses an ITIN number, we will not be getting a Stimulus check.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics ... spartanntp


Colossians 2:8-10...See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, which are based on human tradition and the spiritual forces of the world rather than on Christ. For in HIM dwells all the fullness of the GODHEAD bodily; and you are complete in HIM, who is the head of all principality and power.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by glalt » May 6, 2020, 10:22 am

I am a US citizen with a SS number living in Thailand. I filed a joint tax return in February with my Thai wife who has an ITIN. My US accountant told me that it appears that we will get nothing, that includes me and my wife.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by tutone » May 6, 2020, 10:23 am

You are reading it right. It has been reported in multiple publications and websites. It applies to me as well. Luckily although I could use the money, I don't need it. The sad part of this rule is that a citizen living in the U.S., now without income because of the pandemic, is denied help solely because they are married to a non citizen, and any children they have will suffer also. Disgraceful! This is how racist, xenophobic policy can be detrimental to all citizens. Right now the U.S. is probably the worst place to be for someone who has high expectations. MAGA MY ASS!

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by marcsarge » May 6, 2020, 6:42 pm

I too have file a joint Tax with my TW for years. I am retired Military, retired Gov Civilian and believe that this is an injustice to all those of us in this situation. When I first read the conditions it only said people with ITIN's wouldn't get money they never said a American born citizen would not. I believe that ITIN's should get it also and weeks ago I sent my feelings about this to my Rep in Congress. I been waiting thinking that it would come but now I know why. I'm from TX you can be sure I will be sending something to Governor, US house and Senate members and the President. I will be heard whether anything will change I doubt it.
tutone
You have the right to think the way you do but your comment just shows your a never Trumper so everything you say means nothing. This might be a racist, xenophobic policy but since both parties signed on to it then all would be racist, xenophobic. My guess is in the hurry to get this bill out not much was read by the members of congress that why almost always these rushed bills bite us in butt months later.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by anefarious1 » May 7, 2020, 9:42 am

As I understand it, you get 3 chances at qualifying for the $1,200 because it's based on any of 3 returns (2018, 2019 and 2020). If any of those returns are filed as Married Filing Separately, instead of Married Filing Jointly, you should eventually get the $1,200. Of course, doing this could cost a taxpayer money in other ways. It really depends in your situation, but there is a way to get the stimulus money even if married to a non-citizen.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by marcsarge » May 8, 2020, 9:59 am

This is update on my situation. I sent E-mails as I said I would in my pass post and like every day for the past 20 days or today I went to the Get My Payment site type in my information and ---- it says they will mail my check on the 8th. Of course that means in a few hours because its still 7th there. I also type in TW information and it says same as with mine. Not sure if that means she gets check also or if only I get one. With that said it figures the day after I send E-mails this happened. My thoughts are that why mail it? I owned a little money this year so no banking information but they say they go back to 2018 which they own me money so banking information was in 2018 but they mail anyway to Thailand. Most of as probably know its a shot in the dark receiving mail here sometimes. It could be here in 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years or never. With that said luckily for me my bank let me deposit checks from computer or phone by taking a picture of it, if it didn't when I get the check it would be a major pain in the butt to get the check cashed. Will update if check or checks ever make it here.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by semperfiguy » May 8, 2020, 2:41 pm

marcsarge wrote:
May 8, 2020, 9:59 am
This is update on my situation. I sent E-mails as I said I would in my pass post and like every day for the past 20 days or today I went to the Get My Payment site type in my information and **** it says they will mail my check on the 8th. Of course that means in a few hours because its still 7th there. I also type in TW information and it says same as with mine. Not sure if that means she gets check also or if only I get one. With that said it figures the day after I send E-mails this happened. My thoughts are that why mail it? I owned a little money this year so no banking information but they say they go back to 2018 which they own me money so banking information was in 2018 but they mail anyway to Thailand. Most of as probably know its a shot in the dark receiving mail here sometimes. It could be here in 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years or never. With that said luckily for me my bank let me deposit checks from computer or phone by taking a picture of it, if it didn't when I get the check it would be a major pain in the butt to get the check cashed. Will update if check or checks ever make it here.
Thanks for your update marcsarge! So, I guess there's still hope in my case which is the same as yours. I still get no feedback when I log into "Get My Payment" under both my SSN and my wife's ITIN. I last supplied direct deposit info on my 2010 return, but since then I have not owed money nor qualified for a refund so there was no need to add the direct deposit info to the return; however, the 2010 direct deposit info is still the same today. Perhaps they will be paying me as a receiver of SSI and that is why it is taking longer. Guess I'll just have to wait it out.
Colossians 2:8-10...See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, which are based on human tradition and the spiritual forces of the world rather than on Christ. For in HIM dwells all the fullness of the GODHEAD bodily; and you are complete in HIM, who is the head of all principality and power.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by papafarang » May 8, 2020, 6:06 pm

Very odd ,SS is a socialist concept . Free money is communist idea . Since the outbreak I'm so supprised about Americans that sudden!y give up free market capitalism to become socialist even guys here with no need for the extra cash suddenly believing in communism. Just sayjn
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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by noosard » May 8, 2020, 6:17 pm

I believe george wrote some people are more equal than others
I an not likely to get squat from loving caring government
Not true they will send me tax bill

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by glalt » May 9, 2020, 9:37 am

papafarang wrote:
May 8, 2020, 6:06 pm
Very odd ,SS is a socialist concept . Free money is communist idea . Since the outbreak I'm so supprised about Americans that sudden!y give up free market capitalism to become socialist even guys here with no need for the extra cash suddenly believing in communism. Just sayjn
You obviously have no idea how Social Security works. It is actually the same as a savings account. A percentage of your salary is taken and put into your account. We pay into the program all of our working lives. And yes, everyone has an account. If you live long enough to retire, your payback is based on how much you have put in the account. You may ask why the system is going broke. It is because of all the socialist programs funded by the liberals with money taken from Social Security. Many of those programs are actually welfare and should not be funded with Social Security funds.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by mak » May 9, 2020, 10:26 am

On a side note, has anyone received their stimulus check through direct deposit in their Thai bank?

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by Udon Map » May 9, 2020, 11:00 am

glalt wrote:
May 9, 2020, 9:37 am
You obviously have no idea how Social Security works.
Nor, apparently, do you. Social Security is nothing like a savings account. With a savings account, you put money in, and eventually take your money out, with interest. With Social Security, benefits are paid from the funds collected from the paychecks of people who are working now. Current payments are funded with current collections. The money that you contributed to Social Security through the FICA deductions from your pay was paid out to the people collecting at that time.

The reason that the system is going bankrupt is that baby boomers are retiring, thus swelling the number of people collecting. At the same time, birth rates have gone down substantially over the years, so there are fewer people working and contributing to the system.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by glalt » May 9, 2020, 11:39 am

What is the amount of your monthly Social Security payment? It is based on what you paid in. How do they keep track of how much you paid in? It is in an account and kept track of with your Social Security number. Is Medicaid for retired citizens or is it welfare? Medicare is for retired senior citizens. You DO have a Social Security account. The government couldn't stand to see trillions of dollars in the Social Security trust fund so they eliminated the trust fund in addition to funding other welfare programs. True or not?

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by Udon Map » May 9, 2020, 12:47 pm

glalt wrote:
May 9, 2020, 11:39 am
What is the amount of your monthly Social Security payment? It is based on what you paid in.
Agreed. It is calculated by a formula that is based on what you paid in.
glalt wrote:
May 9, 2020, 11:39 am
How do they keep track of how much you paid in? It is in an account and kept track of with your Social Security number.
No, it's not. The money you pay in is not kept in an account for you. It is paid out to people currently receiving benefits/payments. The Social Security Administration keeps track of how much you pay in; but it doesn't actually keep the money as yours, -- it's just a number in a computer. It doesn't keep your money in an account for you to collect later. The money is used to pay current benefits to other people.


glalt wrote:
May 9, 2020, 11:39 am
Is Medicaid for retired citizens or is it welfare? Medicare is for retired senior citizens. You DO have a Social Security account.
No, you don't. From a publication of the Social Security Administration called Understanding The Benefits:
Where your Social Security tax dollars go

In 2020, when you work, 85 cents of every Social Security tax dollar you pay goes to a trust fund that pays monthly
benefits to current retirees and their families and to surviving spouses and children of workers who have died. About 15 cents goes to a trust fund that pays benefits to people with disabilities and their families.


glalt wrote:
May 9, 2020, 11:39 am
The government couldn't stand to see trillions of dollars in the Social Security trust fund so they eliminated the trust fund in addition to funding other welfare programs. True or not?
Not true. From that same SSA publication:
The current Social Security system works like this: when you work, you pay taxes into Social Security. We use the tax money to pay benefits to:

• People who have already retired.
• People who are disabled.
• Survivors of workers who have died.
• Dependents of beneficiaries.

The money you pay in taxes isn’t held in a personal account for you to use when you get benefits. We use your taxes to pay people who are getting benefits right now. Any unused money goes to the Social Security trust funds, not a personal account with your name on it.
https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10024.pdf

The Trust Fund hasn't been eliminated. At the end of 2019, the Trust Fund had a balance of USD $2,897,400,000,000 ($2.897 trillion). https://www.ssa.gov/OACT/TR/2020/tr2020.pdf


This pretty much says it all, concisely and clearly:
The money you pay in taxes isn’t held in a personal account for you to use when you get benefits. We use your taxes to pay people who are getting benefits right now. Any unused money goes to the Social Security trust funds, not a personal account with your name on it.
Page 2, in this publication: https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10024.pdf

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by papafarang » May 9, 2020, 3:27 pm

glalt wrote:
May 9, 2020, 9:37 am
papafarang wrote:
May 8, 2020, 6:06 pm
Very odd ,SS is a socialist concept . Free money is communist idea . Since the outbreak I'm so supprised about Americans that sudden!y give up free market capitalism to become socialist even guys here with no need for the extra cash suddenly believing in communism. Just sayjn
You obviously have no idea how Social Security works. It is actually the same as a savings account. A percentage of your salary is taken and put into your account. We pay into the program all of our working lives. And yes, everyone has an account. If you live long enough to retire, your payback is based on how much you have put in the account. You may ask why the system is going broke. It is because of all the socialist programs funded by the liberals with money taken from Social Security. Many of those programs are actually welfare and should not be funded with Social Security funds.
Sorry my mistake , social security is a different thing in the UK, our equivalent is the old age pension ,anyone who receives social security in the UK is either in a low paid job/part time and needs a top up . As for socialist programs funded by liberals ,that is what the stimulus package is. Free money for nothing . The joke being played on the people is that it's not to put towards a holiday or a new TV , it is in fact to make sure big businesses get money. Rather than dishing the money to bail out all the broke companies its given to citizens to hand over , the electric company,the gas company,the water company, the credit card companies plus the banks. Real sneaky of them , it appears like you get it but in truth it's free money for companies. Fooled again. Then of course it will have to be paid back some day and banks won't pay extra tax , Joe citizen will have to pay it back in the end. .
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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by Jello » May 9, 2020, 5:09 pm

papafarang wrote:
May 9, 2020, 3:27 pm
As for socialist programs funded by liberals ,that is what the stimulus package is. Free money for nothing . The joke being played on the people is that it's not to put towards a holiday or a new TV , it is in fact to make sure big businesses get money. Rather than dishing the money to bail out all the broke companies its given to citizens to hand over , the electric company,the gas company,the water company, the credit card companies plus the banks. Real sneaky of them , it appears like you get it but in truth it's free money for companies. Fooled again. Then of course it will have to be paid back some day and banks won't pay extra tax , Joe citizen will have to pay it back in the end. .
Or so the millions of people who’ve lost their jobs can eat and not become homeless.

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by cali4995 » May 9, 2020, 5:10 pm

the stimulus check is a tax credit , there are other
tax credits for low-income families that can result
in payments. nothing to do with social sec system

not being a certified public accountant or tax attorney , i'd also be pressed to define nuances of
current insolvent s.s. system / pyramid scheme

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by Jello » May 9, 2020, 5:49 pm

I think being able to file a joint return over the years has saved me more than the stimulus check would be.
As a retiree living overseas and already getting a monthly check from the US government, I have no issue with being excluded from the stimulus checks.
However the woman not getting a check in SFGs linked article (living in the US, lost her job, 4 kids, husband has a ITIN and is stuck outside the country) is truly a injustice.
immigrants who do not have legal status are excluded from the stimulus payments, even if they have work visas or use an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (which the IRS issues to workers without SSN) to pay annual taxes. Additionally, if they file joint tax returns with their spouses, both parties are ineligible for the checks; the CARES Act’s provisions require both parties on a couple’s return to have SSN and will not accept joint returns with one or more Individual Taxpayer ID numbers.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/immig ... us-checks/

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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by papafarang » May 9, 2020, 5:54 pm

Jello wrote:
May 9, 2020, 5:09 pm
papafarang wrote:
May 9, 2020, 3:27 pm
As for socialist programs funded by liberals ,that is what the stimulus package is. Free money for nothing . The joke being played on the people is that it's not to put towards a holiday or a new TV , it is in fact to make sure big businesses get money. Rather than dishing the money to bail out all the broke companies its given to citizens to hand over , the electric company,the gas company,the water company, the credit card companies plus the banks. Real sneaky of them , it appears like you get it but in truth it's free money for companies. Fooled again. Then of course it will have to be paid back some day and banks won't pay extra tax , Joe citizen will have to pay it back in the end. .
Or so the millions of people who’ve lost their jobs can eat and not become homeless.
I guess what rubs me up is people bitching about not getting their free cash when they don't live in America and don't even need they money anyway . My wife made me proud when we had to shut down 50% of her business ,she said we wil be ok ,she didn't even want the 5000b a month hand out. Her words were ..... Other people need it more than we do.
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Re: No Stimulus check for some US Citizens Abroad

Post by glalt » May 9, 2020, 7:47 pm

You DO have a Social Security account. You are correct that the monthly check doesn't come out of your account. That account is to keep track of what you have paid in and determines how much you will get every month. When you are retired, no more money goes into your account and nothing comes out. It is simply a record of what you have paid in during your working life.

The Social Security Trust Fund was gutted and is now full of IOU's. What happens if the government cannot pay the retired people? The money actually existed before the politicians got their hands on it and swapped IOU's for the cash.

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