Moderna v Pfizer

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Teacher Dan
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Teacher Dan » December 16, 2021, 1:54 pm

sometimewoodworker wrote:
December 16, 2021, 1:20 pm
Teacher Dan wrote:
December 16, 2021, 11:37 am
the Pfizer vaccine is not only still available but was supposedly approved by the FDA. Then the simple fact that I don't care if the percentage is 1%, would you want to be one of that 1%?
You are still totally crazy with your percentages if the percentage was anything remotely connected to your claim
1% = USA 2 million deaths
1% = world deaths of 36 million

If there have been as many as 6,000 deaths that would represent a 0.00016% chance of death

Since world wide deaths are at about 5.3 million (possibly double)
And the US deaths are at 0.8 million
That would make the vaccination vastly more deadly than COVID

There is no research that I know of, in human subjects, that differentiates between possible deaths due to the vaccine itself and of the vaccine being injected intravenously as opposed to intramuscularly as designed.

There is research in animal models that shows that intravenous injections carry a significant risk.
I didn't give percentages at all so how am I crazy? I simply asked is that if it were 1% would you want to be that 1? Stop deflecting.


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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Declan MacPherson » December 16, 2021, 4:08 pm

* * *

No matter how the fear merchants slice it, whether it is percentages or raw numbers or ratios, the result is the same.

WORLDWIDE - Infections to Survival
Percentage? 98% survival of the infected worldwide.
Ratio? (98 to 2) 49 to 1 survival of the infected worldwide.
Raw numbers? 265+ million survivors out of the 270+ million infected worldwide.

Every way of calculating it crushes the fear factor.

And the news is even better when looking at total population.

WORLDWIDE - Total Population to Infections and Fatalities
Only 270+ million cases worldwide out of 7.9+ billion people means that 7.63+ billion escaped even being infected. Only 3.4% of the world's total population was even infected, and only 0.067% of the world population had a fatal reaction. Ratio of total world population? 1,490+ uninfected/survival rate worldwide to every 1 fatality.

Other raw numbers worldwide? Deaths worldwide have been 5.3+ million (and only a fear merchant would claim that number to be "possibly double" . . . based on what exactly? Everything indicates that the reported covid death numbers have been falsely inflated from the very beginning.).

That 5.3+ million worldwide fatalities number happens to be less than 2% of the entire U.S. population.

U.S. - Infections and Survival and Total Population
And while we are on the U.S., their fatality raw numbers are at 800,000. That raw number translates to less than one quarter of one percent (0.24%) fatality rate against the entire U.S. population. Ratio in the entire U.S. population? 400+ survival to 1 fatality. In the U.S., fatalities to infections is 1.59%, which is less that the worldwide fatality rate of 2% of infections.

So raw numbers or percentages or ratios, the fear merchants can slice it however they want to slice it. The glass is almost completely full when it comes to survival.

If this is a naturally occurring disaster, as all of those agree who want to protect the CCP, and considering that the country of origin did nothing to assist the world in fighting this naturally occurring disaster claim, the population of the world has done rather well. When one considers all of the flip-flopping, political influence, tyrannical censorship, and lies used to cover up mistakes (or cover up outright lies), it makes the world's survival of this evil (so far) a great accomplishment.


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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Doodoo » December 16, 2021, 4:23 pm

Heah Dec did you ever get vaccinated?

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Laan Yaa Mo » December 16, 2021, 7:42 pm

deankham wrote:
December 16, 2021, 12:08 pm
^ no need Yaa Mo you'll probably by dead by then or we'll be onto the Gamma (Frozen North Eskimo version) variant.

Why does someone keep bleeting on about Swine Flu death rates? How does that compare as a percentage of those vaccinated for Swine Flu?

It's all about the percentages folks. Absolute numbers mean jack without the context.
Jeez, I was hoping to hang around for a few more Grey Cups not just a month or so. But, who knows, your prediction might be spot on.
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by deankham » December 16, 2021, 10:07 pm

^ I was only playing Unc. I pray to Odin that you'll be around for many moons to come.

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Laan Yaa Mo » December 16, 2021, 10:38 pm

deankham wrote:
December 16, 2021, 10:07 pm
^ I was only playing Unc. I pray to Odin that you'll be around for many moons to come.
I know you were. But Odin? What happened to Zeus?
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by glalt » December 17, 2021, 9:43 am

I live in the boonies of Loei province. I was not vaccinated because there was no vaccine available. Our little village was Covid free for a long time, BUT, somehow my wife and I both got infected. Who is to say whether I would have been infected if I had been vaccinated? As it is, that virus is certainly no fun. Due to the meds I received while in the hospital quarantine, the doctor says I must wait for three months before getting vaccinated. After being released from the hospital, my sense of taste and smell is still not 100 percent or even 50 percent. It comes and goes. I am still weak and clumsy more than two and a half months after being released. My wife also complains of being tired all the time but she Is Covid to blame? Maybe it is just my old age? I am feeling much better but will get vaccinated as soon as the three months is up. Are the vaccines safe? I don't know, but I will take my chances because I don't want to have to go through being that sick again. The numbers may be being manipulated but the general consensus and numbers show that vaccines do work.

I'll add that I am old enough to have seen friends being crippled with polio. That and other childhood diseases are now gone because of the scientists.

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by tamada » December 17, 2021, 11:16 am

I heard a snippet on the UK radio about the improving recovery rate from 'long Covid' so we will see if that gets burried in the current omicron panic.

In other news, the UK's first-reported omicron victim was unvaccinated by choice. Elderly, 80-something but otherwise healthy bloke who lived alone, seldom went out, kept himself to himself and only relied on online shopping and food deliveries.

In other, other news, the 40-something winner of some '90-day fiance' game show also just died from Covid. He too was unvaccinated by choice.

Stay safe out there glalt and get well soon.
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by papafarang » December 17, 2021, 11:39 am

glalt wrote:
December 17, 2021, 9:43 am
I live in the boonies of Loei province. I was not vaccinated because there was no vaccine available. Our little village was Covid free for a long time, BUT, somehow my wife and I both got infected. Who is to say whether I would have been infected if I had been vaccinated? As it is, that virus is certainly no fun. Due to the meds I received while in the hospital quarantine, the doctor says I must wait for three months before getting vaccinated. After being released from the hospital, my sense of taste and smell is still not 100 percent or even 50 percent. It comes and goes. I am still weak and clumsy more than two and a half months after being released. My wife also complains of being tired all the time but she Is Covid to blame? Maybe it is just my old age? I am feeling much better but will get vaccinated as soon as the three months is up. Are the vaccines safe? I don't know, but I will take my chances because I don't want to have to go through being that sick again. The numbers may be being manipulated but the general consensus and numbers show that vaccines do work.

I'll add that I am old enough to have seen friends being crippled with polio. That and other childhood diseases are now gone because of the scientists.
98,000,000 doses of vaccines have been given out in thailand, 857 deaths have been investigated as suspect , when natural causes , disease like cancer ,heart attacks are taken out it came down to 3 known deaths , 2 from thrombosis and one they said was shock. so quite safe indeed. i also doubt you'll grow an extra arm or horns out of your head.
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by AlexO » December 17, 2021, 1:11 pm

Spot on Dean.
The doom merchants would have us believe we are all lab rats. Quite gladly going for a booster jab (Pfizer) some time this month and then the Moderna around April. Don't care if I get a couple of more pimples on my ass, way better than being stuck in one of those tents with oxygen filters and just dying alone in a plastic tomb.

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by jai yen yen » December 18, 2021, 12:44 am

glalt wrote:
December 17, 2021, 9:43 am
I live in the boonies of Loei province. I was not vaccinated because there was no vaccine available. Our little village was Covid free for a long time, BUT, somehow my wife and I both got infected. Who is to say whether I would have been infected if I had been vaccinated? As it is, that virus is certainly no fun. Due to the meds I received while in the hospital quarantine, the doctor says I must wait for three months before getting vaccinated. After being released from the hospital, my sense of taste and smell is still not 100 percent or even 50 percent. It comes and goes. I am still weak and clumsy more than two and a half months after being released. My wife also complains of being tired all the time but she Is Covid to blame? Maybe it is just my old age? I am feeling much better but will get vaccinated as soon as the three months is up. Are the vaccines safe? I don't know, but I will take my chances because I don't want to have to go through being that sick again. The numbers may be being manipulated but the general consensus and numbers show that vaccines do work.

I'll add that I am old enough to have seen friends being crippled with polio. That and other childhood diseases are now gone because of the scientists.
Some say that you will have natural antibodies after having Covid and possibly better than the vaccines provide.

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by deankham » December 18, 2021, 1:14 am

^true but would be seldom comfort if he'd died when first caught covid....

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Declan MacPherson » December 18, 2021, 8:01 am

jai yen yen wrote:
December 18, 2021, 12:44 am
Some say that you will have natural antibodies after having Covid and possibly better than the vaccines provide.
Yes. True.

My brother in Tennessee had covid for about 3 days. Treated it with Ivermectin. No lingering effects.

He has the antibodies; and his doctor advised him NOT to get vaccinated after being infected. He was told that there was better than a 50-50 chance that the vaccine would disturb his immune system and those antibodies. His odds of being reinfected are far less because he has the antibodies. Seems to be true since we are seeing so many vaccinated being infected.

I have followed that same advice after using the HCQ cocktail.
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by papafarang » December 18, 2021, 8:29 am

jai yen yen wrote:
December 18, 2021, 12:44 am
glalt wrote:
December 17, 2021, 9:43 am
I live in the boonies of Loei province. I was not vaccinated because there was no vaccine available. Our little village was Covid free for a long time, BUT, somehow my wife and I both got infected. Who is to say whether I would have been infected if I had been vaccinated? As it is, that virus is certainly no fun. Due to the meds I received while in the hospital quarantine, the doctor says I must wait for three months before getting vaccinated. After being released from the hospital, my sense of taste and smell is still not 100 percent or even 50 percent. It comes and goes. I am still weak and clumsy more than two and a half months after being released. My wife also complains of being tired all the time but she Is Covid to blame? Maybe it is just my old age? I am feeling much better but will get vaccinated as soon as the three months is up. Are the vaccines safe? I don't know, but I will take my chances because I don't want to have to go through being that sick again. The numbers may be being manipulated but the general consensus and numbers show that vaccines do work.

I'll add that I am old enough to have seen friends being crippled with polio. That and other childhood diseases are now gone because of the scientists.
Some say that you will have natural antibodies after having Covid and possibly better than the vaccines provide.
those antibodies will disappear when they do you will be able to catch covid again. i wonder what the effect of catching covid multiple times might have ,apart from every time you catch it you risk dying
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Declan MacPherson » December 18, 2021, 8:54 am

* * *

https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/good-ne ... rotection/
Good news: Mild COVID-19 induces lasting antibody protection
“Last fall, there were reports that antibodies wane quickly after infection with the virus that causes COVID-19, and mainstream media interpreted that to mean that immunity was not long-lived,” said senior author Ali Ellebedy, PhD, an associate professor of pathology & immunology, of medicine and of molecular microbiology. “But that’s a misinterpretation of the data. It’s normal for antibody levels to go down after acute infection, but they don’t go down to zero; they plateau. Here, we found antibody-producing cells in people 11 months after first symptoms. These cells will live and produce antibodies for the rest of people’s lives. That’s strong evidence for long-lasting immunity.”
There is also the question of damage to the immune system from the spike proteins contained in the vaccines. Numerous articles online are available that outline this damage.

https://greatgameindia.com/spike-protei ... na-repair/
Spike Protein Induced By COVID Vaccines Inhibits DNA Repair & Is Linked To Cancer Finds Major Swedish Study

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by fatbob » December 18, 2021, 9:53 am

[/quote] Some say that you will have natural antibodies after having Covid and possibly better than the vaccines provide.
[/quote]
those antibodies will disappear when they do you will be able to catch covid again. i wonder what the effect of catching covid multiple times might have ,apart from every time you catch it you risk dying
[/quote]

'Those antibodies will disappear', where on earth did you pluck that from? Certainly not from the leading immunoligists or viroligists, how untrue, I suppose your next statment is Phizer or Moderna is better....55555

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by papafarang » December 18, 2021, 10:24 am

fatbob wrote:
December 18, 2021, 9:53 am
Some say that you will have natural antibodies after having Covid and possibly better than the vaccines provide.
[/quote]
those antibodies will disappear when they do you will be able to catch covid again. i wonder what the effect of catching covid multiple times might have ,apart from every time you catch it you risk dying
[/quote]

'Those antibodies will disappear', where on earth did you pluck that from? Certainly not from the leading immunoligists or viroligists, how untrue, I suppose your next statment is Phizer or Moderna is better....55555
[/quote]

Have you not been reading about re infections ? the reason we spend our lives catching colds and flu is because natural immunity wanes and you become susceptible again , not enough data yet to figure out how long but scientists say it could be as little as 3 months or could be up to 5 years, but that can't be proved for another 5 years. . what on earth makes YOU think phizer is better than moderna ? i certainly don't
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by Declan MacPherson » December 18, 2021, 10:48 am

fatbob wrote:
December 18, 2021, 9:53 am
where on earth did you pluck that from? Certainly not from the leading immunoligists or viroligists, how untrue
Plucked probably from one of those discussions by those fear merchant flat earthers. Image
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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by jackspratt » December 18, 2021, 10:56 am

From today's Economist Espresso:
A new study by researchers at Imperial College London found no evidence of a difference in severity between the Omicron variant of covid-19 and the Delta variant. The risk of reinfection, however, is 5.4 times higher. Previous infection or a two-dose vaccine regimen offer no more than 20% protection against symptomatic cases of Omicron—but a booster from an mRNA jab can push this figure up to 55-80%. Omicron is quickly supplanting other strains: it now dominates in England, accounting for 54% of cases.
https://www.economist.com/espresso
And from the study:
.....The researchers found that in Britain a two-dose course of the Pfizer or AstraZeneca vaccine was, at most, 20% effective against infection by Omicron. Having had covid in the past was also of little help, conferring only 19% protection—far less than the 85% against Delta found in other studies.

Boosters, however, can make a big difference. A third jab using Pfizer’s vaccine after an initial course of the AstraZeneca or Pfizer jab was between 55% and 80% effective against infection by Omicron.....
https://www.economist.com/science-and-t ... -the-world
Interesting, in light of a couple of "expert" opinions above. :-k

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Re: Moderna v Pfizer

Post by papafarang » December 18, 2021, 11:03 am

Declan MacPherson wrote:
December 18, 2021, 10:48 am
fatbob wrote:
December 18, 2021, 9:53 am
where on earth did you pluck that from? Certainly not from the leading immunoligists or viroligists, how untrue
Plucked probably from one of those discussions by those fear merchant flat earthers. Image
Image
sorry but the only person i know who lives in fear or are afraid is you. no one is scared of having the vaccine, except two who both think covid does not exist or it's a conspiracy by the lizzard people running the US government, both crackpots like yourself. i think you misunderstand the UFES, we sit ,we listen and then we have a good laugh and take the piss out of them. you should pop in sometime and get well roasted :lol:
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