Renewing the extension on a Non O Visa

[wokkawombat]

My current extension to my Non O expires on 9 march 2008. As I am in two minds as to whether I want to stay in Thailand longer than another year I am not prepared to transfer any money in. I have enough in travellers cheques to tide me other. I intend going to Laos to get 30 days more about 9 March and then will return to OZ for a couple of months returning to Thailand late May 2008.

I had to go to Nong Khai on Tuesday so I decided to sound them out at Immigration to see if I could get an extension when it is due simply by showing docs from Aust Govt and Embassy certifying my income, (in excess of the required monthly amount) and a bank balance of about 100,000 Baht. I also had travellers cheques with me to show them.

I told them I did not want to transfer money for my own reasons but they insisted I have to transfer money in each month. "Like this" he said as he showed me a statement from someones file showing deposits each month from overseas.

He then showed me a form "Application for Retirement Visa extension as of the 1st October 2006".

Paragraph 4 clearly stated "In case of having monthly income. Applicant must provide evidence of a monthly income with a minimum income of 65,000 Thai Baht". Nowhere did it state an amount in the bank or monthly deposits. When I pointed this out to him his command of English rapidly diminished.

This outcome did not particularly worry me as I can get a multiple entry Non O in Brisbane without any problems and I intend doing a bit of border hopping in the next year to visit other countries.

I am sure they are incorrect but Nong Khai Immigration have their own interpretation of the rules.

I received my extension last year on the strength of the Aust Govt and Embassy docs and a bank balance of 400,000 Baht

John

[arjay]

Paragraph 4 clearly stated "In case of having monthly income. Applicant must provide evidence of a monthly income with a minimum income of 65,000 Thai Baht". Nowhere did it state an amount in the bank or monthly deposits. When I pointed this out to him his command of English rapidly diminished.

John, my understanding is the same as yours and is correct. If you have, and can prove, a monthly income of 65k baht, then you do NOT have to have that amount transferred into a bank account over here each month. They simply want to see that you do have a bank a/c here with some money in it. We are talking of the retirement visa O/A here.

It's only when one does not have a confirmable monthly income as high as 65K, that the third option comes into play, whereby you have to show that the total balance in a bank a/c in LOS, plus amounts transferred in over the year total 800K baht.

[wokkawombat]

Arjay, my visa is a multiple entry Non Immigrant O and I was looking at renewing the 12 month extensions I got the last 2 years.

Ray, thanks for the PM, sorry I could not reply but my connection kept dropping out.

John

[wokkawombat]

My current extension to my Non O expires on 9 march 2008. As I am in two minds as to whether I want to stay in Thailand longer than another year I am not prepared to transfer any money in. I have enough in travellers cheques to tide me other. I intend going to Laos to get 30 days more about 9 March and then will return to OZ for a couple of months returning to Thailand late May 2008.

I had to go to Nong Khai on Tuesday so I decided to sound them out at Immigration to see if I could get an extension when it is due simply by showing docs from Aust Govt and Embassy certifying my income, (in excess of the required monthly amount) and a bank balance of about 100,000 Baht. I also had travellers cheques with me to show them.

I told them I did not want to transfer money for my own reasons but they insisted I have to transfer money in each month. "Like this" he said as he showed me a statement from someones file showing deposits each month from overseas.

He then showed me a form "Application for Retirement Visa extension as of the 1st October 2006".

Paragraph 4 clearly stated "In case of having monthly income. Applicant must provide evidence of a monthly income with a minimum income of 65,000 Thai Baht". Nowhere did it state an amount in the bank or monthly deposits. When I pointed this out to him his command of English rapidly diminished.

This outcome did not particularly worry me as I can get a multiple entry Non O in Brisbane without any problems and I intend doing a bit of border hopping in the next year to visit other countries.

I am sure they are incorrect but Nong Khai Immigration have their own interpretation of the rules.

I received my extension last year on the strength of the Aust Govt and Embassy docs and a bank balance of 400,000 Baht

John

Ok, extremely bad form to quote your own posts but this is my year of saying WTF.

Results of todays expedition to Thai Immigration in BKK.

I now have a Retirement stamp in my passport valid to 09/03/2008.
Apart from the 3 hour wait (and heart palpatations as I had a flight back to Udon at 5:30 pm) and having to scuttle across the road to copy a passport page I had missed, it all went ahead without any questions and with smiling, friendly staff. What a change from Nong Khai.

I had a Stat Declaration stamped by the OZ Embassy stating income.

A letter from the OZ Govt. department that pays my pension, stamped by the embassy.

A letter from BKK Bank stating the balance of my accounts.

Copies of bank books, passport, TM6 etc.

My bank books showed a balance of approx 400k baht of which 340k had been deposited in Thailand in the last 2 weeks.

All in all a happy day for me.

Only thing that did not go ok was getting my Re-entry and doing a 90 day report while in BKK but I would have missed my flight. Oh well, I will get to see the smiling faces at Nong Khai on Friday.

John

[arjay]

I'm sure you will be aware John that this has been a point I have repeatedly made in the past - the fact that if one has and can get the pension income of min 65K baht per month certified by the Embassy, there is no requirement to have a specified amount in a Thai bank account, as much as Nong Khai try and assert there is.

The first and third years I renewed mine, it was done without problem in Phuket. The second year I did it in Nong Khai and they did, when I made a preliminary enquiry, try and assert that I needed to have 12 x 65K transferred into my Thai bank within the year, but when I actually went back to do it the following week, they correctly extended my visa without taking any note of the amount I had in my Thai bank account (which was under 300K baht at the time).

I am glad you've got that weight of your mind.

By the way I think you meant you now have a stamp in your passport valid to 09/03/09.

[BKKSTAN]

Last year in Bangkok,I used my letter from the income and although I had a letter from the bank and my bankbook(60+K baht),she said I would not need it or the health cert. next year!

[wokkawombat]

Arjay, yes 09/03/2009, whew....

[polehawk]

Congrats on getting a hassle-free extension, wokkawombat. So the Bangkok Immy didn't try to steer you back to Nong Khai, eh? I've also been considering taking my docs to Bangkok when my turn comes up in July to renew. From your post (and Stan's), this appears the road to take to ease my hypertension.

[rickfarang]

Oh well, I will get to see the smiling faces at Nong Khai on Friday.

John

Congratulations on getting your extension. Its too bad that Nong Khai policies are so much more restrictive than those in Bangkok. I can only guess as to why this is

Please let us know whether those faces in Nong Khai are still smiling after they see that you extended in Bangkok. Maybe they don't even care, but I was given a small amount of grief by an officer from Nong Khai a couple of years ago when I did the same.

[Mainer]

Congrats on the renewal, John.

I am planning to renew my Non-O retirement visa in Nong Khai on 19 or 20 March. The visa expires 3 April. That will give me 2 weeks to correct any problems that arrive, to include a trip to attempt a renewal in Bangkok.

I have been depositing money for 3 months into a Thai bank. My balance is a bit less than 300K baht. I have a notorized paper from the US Embassy stating I receive the needed income per month. I will get a statement from my Thai bank showing my recent deposts. I should mention I get my money using my ATM card and never have wired money to Thailand. I will copy all my ATM receipts in order, by date and also make a copy of my bank's ledger, showing that this is where the money came from on the corresponding dates.

I will also get a paper from a doctor, copies of my passport and copy of US Embassy income paper.

This will be my second 1-year retirement visa renewal. I did all of the above last year and it went smooth in Nong Khai. He did not ask me for proof of transfer (as far as I can remember).

Am I forgetting anything?

[rickfarang]

Mainer, some of what you wrote puzzle me, based on my understanding and a guess that you have either a retired guy's or a married guy's visa. Please note that I don't know as much about visas as I think I do, and of course the immigration officers are often allowed to exercise their own judgment in determining who meets the qualifications. Having said that, I am quite curious to know whether any of the items below result in complications for you when you extend in a few days.

1. 300k in bank placed there over three months: Does it have to have been in the bank for three months prior to extending? Is 300k enough for your case?

2. ATM receipts: Will they accept ATM receipts? If they don't ask for proof of transfer, then this is moot.

3. AFIK, a doctor's certificate has not been required for a retired guy's visa for about three years. Will they ask for it?

[Mainer]

Rick, as I mentioned above, I am going for a Non-O retirement visa. I am not married. I have a paper from the American Embassy stating my income exceeds 65,000 baht per month. According to Thai Immigration, based on their website and a printed guideline (checklist) paper I have, that is really all that is needed. I have never seen where it says I must have money in the bank, if I have a notorized paper showing I meet the income per month. I know there is a lot of discussion about it, but I can not see where it says anywhere that is what is needed. Based on this, they should not ask for proof of money transfer.

However, I am being 'safe' by adding almost 400K in a Thai bank and having ATM slips copied and a printout of my recent American bank's account statement's to back up the ATM slips.

I didn't know I didn't need the doctor's paper, and unless someone else can verify this, I will get one this time and ask Immigration if it is needed or not. Wouldn't it be great if we could sit down over dinner with the Immigration officer and ask him/her what is REALLY required. It would take only a short time and then we would all KNOW !

I will post my experience on here when I return.

[jackspratt]

Mainer, if you a looking for an extension based on income (65k), the paper from the embassy should suffice. However, it is also prudent to have some (imported) money in the bank.

Nong Khai has also been reported as sometimes requiring an applicant to show that 65k per month has been coming into the Thai account. This is not within the regulations, and if they try it on, I would (politely but firmly) request that the supervisor, who is on the second floor, becomes involved.

The need for a doctors certificate also no longer exists. Again, if they try it on, get the supervisor involved.

Unfortunately, as reported on numerous occasions in another Forum, you really never know what surprises some of the pricks at NK will try to spring on you.

Good luck, and look forward to the report.

[BKKSTAN]

Mainer ,you are right about the guidelines.If I were you,I would take all the paperwork there seperated and only show them the basic required documents!Don't show them the Bankbook ,med cert or ATM receipts unless asked to show them specifically

The problem with Jack's suggestion is the last guideline allows the officer to ask for any additional paperwork at his discretion and the supervisor will not overrule her officers decision(loss of face)!

Good Luck and forget that speaking ''firmly'' suggestion!!You will have to comply with the officers requests or leave and go to another Immigration office like BK where they usually follow the basic requirements!

[jackspratt]

Sorry Stan - I have direct reports of an officer being over ruled by the supervisor.

Further, the guidelines allow the officer to request further information to verify the information presented - they do not allow for requiring additional matters outside the scope of the regulations eg monthly transfer of money to Thailand under the "income" route.

This is a copy of the relevant part of the regulation, provided by Sunbelt on the TV Forum:

1. Application form
2. Copy of passport of the applicant
3. Evidences of having income, such as pension or interest of saving
money, or dividends etc. and/ or,
4. Certified Letter of having a bank account with the Bank in Thailand
and the passbook of the account.
5. Only for the Item (6), the Documents in Item 1 – 4 shall be required (NOT RELEVANT - added by me).

And, from the Immigration website:

1. Application form
2. Copy of the applicant's passport
3. Proof of income, e.g., retirement pension, interest earnings or
dividends, etc.; and/or
4. Certificate of local bank account deposit together with copies of
bank account records
5. DELETED BY ME

Up to Mainer which way he goes - if it is me, I will certainly be following my own advice

[arjay]

Yes, I would certainly make sure you have a Thai bank a/c and a letter from the bank certifying it (the bank usually provide me with a photocopy of the pages in the passbook and then stamps and signs each page).

I too agree, as you have the 65K income certified by your Embassy, there is no requirement to have a specific amount in the bank a/c. That said, I usually make sure I have 100-200K upwards and evidence of transfers in from overseas, to ensure it looks good.

I too would agree, don't volunteer any additional documentation over what is required, but keep anything you think may be helpful up your sleeve!!

You no longer need a Doctor's certificate, but I think you may need a photo.

[Bump]

One thing that is very important, we all get nervous when we do this and tend to talk while they do thier paperwork. Save your comments and questions until you have a stamp in your book. If they want something else they will tell you.

Easier said the done

[papaguido]

Yes, I would certainly make sure you have a Thai bank a/c and a letter from the bank certifying it (the bank usually provide me with a photocopy of the pages in the passbook and then stamps and signs each page).

I too agree, as you have the 65K income certified by your Embassy, there is no requirement to have a specific amount in the bank a/c. That said, I usually make sure I have 100-200K upwards and evidence of transfers in from overseas, to ensure it looks good.

I too would agree, don't volunteer any additional documentation over what is required, but keep anything you think may be helpful up your sleeve!!

You no longer need a Doctor's certificate, but I think you may need a photo.

My experience is they wanted a current letter from the bank, either dated the day before or day of depending on when you go.

[Bump]

So far Nong Khai has excepted one from me within ten days. But a catch point is they want the balance on the bank book to match the bank letter.

But nothing has changed the officer can ask for whatever they want. So I try to keep them very close to what Arjay has posted. I also apply a few days early in cae something comes up that I need to deal with. The only thing that ha happened aliong those lines a missed copy that wa needed and one year a medical certificate that wasn't expected. They were in AEK at the time and it could be resolved quickly.

The one thing I always screw up is the copy of the passport pages I copy the entire thing and they look a bit frustrated throwing out papers. I simply don;t understand what they really need. So I use overkill

[BKKSTAN]

One thing that is very important, we all get nervous when we do this and tend to talk while they do thier paperwork. Save your comments and questions until you have a stamp in your book. If they want something else they will tell you.

Easier said the done

Good point!I think staying silent is the way to go.If they ask a question,wait till they look you in the eye because sometimes they are just mumbling comments and not really asking a question!