Radical Islam (opinion)

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ronan01
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by ronan01 » January 13, 2015, 4:11 pm

"Deploring the violence is not enough. Moderate Muslims must walk the walk and openly declare their opposition to those tenets of their faith which support intolerance, discrimination and religious despotism; or else lose all credibility. There is no hiding place when people are being massacred to the accompaniment of Allahu Akbar.

Maybe Jamal Rifi in Australia and Zuhdi Jasser (President of the Islamic Forum for Democracy) in America, and fellow moderate leaders, should take a lead from Martin Luther and nail their colours to mosque doors. It might read something like this:

In affirming our right to practice our religion in democratic and pluralist societies; we, moderate Muslims, renounce and reject any interpretation of our faith, whether sourced from the Koran, the Hadiths, or other authoritative religious writings, which:

- Prevents Muslims from freely leaving their faith if they so wish
- Discriminates in any way against people of other faiths
- Denies equality between men and women
- Imposes punishments for homosexual activity between consenting adults
- Imposes punishments for adultery
- Imposes cruel and unusual punishments (like amputations) for those guilty of criminal offences
- Underwrites, encourages or incites physical harm to those who criticise or satirize Islam or the prophet Muhammad; while preserving a right to peacefully protest and object to such criticism and satire
- Seeks to replace parliamentary law with religious law in non-ecclesiastical matters

This list, which no doubt could be added to and/or finessed, is at a summary level. For example, equality between men and women is meant to cover the proscription of honour killing, wife beating, under-aged marriage, forced marriage, genital mutilation, and other forms of subjugation. By the way, that this needs mentioning at all in this day and age says something about the sorry state of Islam."

http://quadrant.org.au/opinion/qed/2015 ... que-doors/



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Aardvark
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by Aardvark » January 13, 2015, 6:06 pm


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jackspratt
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by jackspratt » January 13, 2015, 7:31 pm

ronan01 wrote: .........In affirming our right to practice our religion in democratic and pluralist societies; we, moderate Muslims, renounce and reject any interpretation of our faith, whether sourced from the Koran, the Hadiths, or other authoritative religious writings, which:

- Prevents Muslims from freely leaving their faith if they so wish
- Discriminates in any way against people of other faiths
- Denies equality between men and women
- Imposes punishments for homosexual activity between consenting adults
- Imposes punishments for adultery
- Imposes cruel and unusual punishments (like amputations) for those guilty of criminal offences
- Underwrites, encourages or incites physical harm to those who criticise or satirize Islam or the prophet Muhammad; while preserving a right to peacefully protest and object to such criticism and satire
- Seeks to replace parliamentary law with religious law in non-ecclesiastical matters
.................
Whilst an admirable wish list, why just stop at Islam?

Many of the above could - in part, or full - apply variously to Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Sikhism etc etc.

An even better outcome would be a world totally free of irrational thoughts and doctrines, which are based on mythical beings. =D>

ronan01
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by ronan01 » January 13, 2015, 8:14 pm

jackspratt wrote:
ronan01 wrote: .........In affirming our right to practice our religion in democratic and pluralist societies; we, moderate Muslims, renounce and reject any interpretation of our faith, whether sourced from the Koran, the Hadiths, or other authoritative religious writings, which:

- Prevents Muslims from freely leaving their faith if they so wish
- Discriminates in any way against people of other faiths
- Denies equality between men and women
- Imposes punishments for homosexual activity between consenting adults
- Imposes punishments for adultery
- Imposes cruel and unusual punishments (like amputations) for those guilty of criminal offences
- Underwrites, encourages or incites physical harm to those who criticise or satirize Islam or the prophet Muhammad; while preserving a right to peacefully protest and object to such criticism and satire
- Seeks to replace parliamentary law with religious law in non-ecclesiastical matters
.................
Whilst an admirable wish list, why just stop at Islam?

Many of the above could - in part, or full - apply variously to Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Sikhism etc etc.

An even better outcome would be a world totally free of irrational thoughts and doctrines, which are based on mythical beings. =D>
- I am not aware that Christianity prevents people leaving the "church" if they wish
- I dont think Christians or Hindu's or Buddhists discriminate against other religions the islam does
- I believe christian churches attempt equality between the sexes, perhaps not totally successful, but the try. Islam does not.
- Secular states, where church and state are separate do not criminalise homosexuality.
- Secular states do not punish adultery, that usual becomes a matter for divorce courts
- I am not aware of amputation or beheading by secular states
- I cant recall people calling for others to be beheaded for insulting jesus / catholicism
- I am not aware of other religions calling for the equivalent of sharia law

What planet are you on Petal?

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jackspratt
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by jackspratt » January 13, 2015, 8:27 pm

ronan01 wrote:
What planet are you on Petal?
A planet where most people can understand uncomplicated English - which is apparently not the case in Alaska, Sarah. :D
Many of the above could - in part, or full - apply variously to..........

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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by ronan01 » January 13, 2015, 8:55 pm

jackspratt wrote:
ronan01 wrote:
What planet are you on Petal?
A planet where most people can understand uncomplicated English - which is apparently not the case in Alaska, Sarah. :D
Many of the above could - in part, or full - apply variously to..........
Dishemblemitis Petal - it can be cured - but you must want to be cured.

Islam is a little bit more than a religion, its a way of life, its a mix of church and state - its a primitive 7th century notion that has failed to come to terms with the modern world.

Christianity had its reformation, Islam has not. Modern states separate church and state, Islam does not, modern states separate the legislature and judiciary, Islam does not.

Islam requires reformation - the point of the article - you just dont get it Petal.

Its not OK to to parade signs on Australian streets, saying "behead those who offend islam", its not ok to shoot people because YOU think they have offended islam, its not ok to demand sharia law in Oz or UK. Its not ok for a so called sheik in Oz to blame women for rape because they wear short skirts (remember the " if you leave the meat out it will attract the cats" comment). Its just not ok.

But you just dont get that. Guess your blinded by your hated of jews.

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jackspratt
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by jackspratt » January 13, 2015, 9:34 pm

Have you seen your doctor recently, ronan?

If not, you really ought to - I am sure there is some medication that will help.
Dishemblemitis
What?
Guess your blinded by your hated of jews.
What?

ronan01
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by ronan01 » January 14, 2015, 11:04 am

Reblogged:

"Islam makes some very large claims for itself. It claims that an illiterate Arab in the Middle Ages was chosen by God to disseminate to the rest of the world the final, unalterable divine instructions for how we should all live. Any institution which makes such claims and wishes to enforce its ideology politically must be willing to be subject to scrutiny, criticism and satire. If its followers can't accept this then just as a scientist who refuses to be peer reviewed they don't deserve to belong in the conversation."

In the meantime:

"An Islamic politician has described the killing of 10 journalists at Charlie Hebdo magazine in Paris and two police officers as a 'cure'.

Ismail Alwahwah, the leader of Hizb ut-Tahrir Australia, wrote the controversial blog on the group's website claiming the horrific shootings were a reaction to the “daily humiliation” of Muslims and “insults to their book and prophet”, reports News Corp.

He also warned Australians that insults to their religion would end in violence.

He wrote: 'It seems some in Australia are arrogantly and irresponsibly heedless of the fact that provoking and insulting a people’s core beliefs is a matter that can only end in acrimony for everyone concerned.

'If that wasn’t enough, the biggest criminals of the world like Obama and Netanyahu are already seeking to exploit the events of last week for their predictable but nefarious purposes, despite the dust not settling and facts yet to be confirmed.'"

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/259 ... ks-a-cure/

"Islamic State fighters must be wiped out, France's defence minister said on Tuesday, indicating that Paris would not pull back from military operations overseas after 17 people were killed by home-grown militants in Paris last week."

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/world ... -minister/

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GT93
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by GT93 » January 14, 2015, 11:25 am

Zero sanuk in this thread. Of course, Zero Sanuk is hanging out here. On his reasoning secularists and Christians should be apologizing every day for the shxt some demented secularists and Christians cause in western countries. Get real.
Lock 'em up - Eastman, Giuliani, Senator Graham, Meadows and Trump

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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by ronan01 » January 15, 2015, 7:44 pm

“All this ‘we stand for free speech’ talk, in this context, actually means ‘we stand for freedom to insult’. This is because the right to civil debate on different ideas and beliefs, any and all, is not disputed by anyone.”

I’m feeling charitable, so I’ll point out that Badar is right on this point. The freedom to insult is a corollary of free speech. A very decent and essential one, I’ll add.

He claims that the real source of Muslim ire is “gratuitous insult”, and herein lies the problem: if you point out that Muhammad is an overrated figure, or that he was a mere mammal, like the rest of humanity, or if you pick up a cartoonist’s pencil with such a subject in mind, you can’t avoid the charge and summary conviction of producing a “gratuitous insult.”

By the way, all non-Muslims are obliged to think some version of the first two things about Muhammad: that he was both the greatest human ever to draw breathand the most perfect specimen to grace the planet with his presence.
"

http://quadrant.org.au/opinion/qed/2015 ... es-circle/

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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by ronan01 » January 15, 2015, 7:44 pm

GT93 wrote:Zero sanuk in this thread. Of course, Zero Sanuk is hanging out here. On his reasoning secularists and Christians should be apologizing every day for the shxt some demented secularists and Christians cause in western countries. Get real.
Hello Dimwit, hows the sheep?

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Astana
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Post by Astana » January 15, 2015, 8:17 pm

“When you meet the unbelievers, strike the necks…” (Qur’an 47:4)

Not, of course, that this has anything to do with Islam but if you don't believe in Islam you will be killed according to Islamic State! Consequently, the 6 Billion people who are non-believers on this planet are all at risk from the directive of a book and an extremely violent organisation.

In one stroke and with the help of Western governments your ability to broadcast, hold public assemblies, publish cartoons or write on the Internet will be curtailed whilst IS goes about its bloody business. Time to take the gloves off with IS and their like.

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Post by vlad » January 15, 2015, 11:40 pm

I watched a Docc last night called White British and proud it showed a group of Ex EDF members forming into a cell to counter Muslim and Islamic groups here in the UK Lucky if there was a dozen yet at every demo they turned up, they were searched hassled and generally obstructed by the Police yet a Hate preacher was allowed to protest and his followers make threatening statements and wave placards about demanding Islamic laws. Absolutely disgusting and showing a total lack of backbone against this kind of rubbish on our Streets today. This group also got wind of a house being used as a meeting place for a banned group called the Muslim brotherhood when they went to demonstrate outside again they were turned away and not allowed to commit an act of " Nuisance "

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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by Earnest » January 16, 2015, 3:41 am

Astana wrote:“When you meet the unbelievers, strike the necks…” (Qur’an 47:4)
Not Cricket. [-X
Astana wrote:Time to take the gloves off with IS and their like.
I thought we had, Asters, air strikes are Nature's way of striking the Unbelievers. :lol:


OK, OK, I'll book myself on the next equality and diversity course. =;
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Post by jackspratt » January 16, 2015, 8:50 am

Quiz time.

Where do these passages come from, and are they still taken literally by the followers of that faith?
Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing (hath gone and served other gods), unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.
But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
:-k

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Post by akwoodworker » January 16, 2015, 8:58 am

I enjoy studying and learning about religions but did not make it past the first few pages of the Quran because of statements like the ones quoted.

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Post by ronan01 » January 16, 2015, 9:40 am

Earnest wrote:
Astana wrote:“When you meet the unbelievers, strike the necks…” (Qur’an 47:4)
Not Cricket. [-X
Astana wrote:Time to take the gloves off with IS and their like.
I thought we had, Asters, air strikes are Nature's way of striking the Unbelievers. :lol:


OK, OK, I'll book myself on the next equality and diversity course. =;
I think you mean air strikes are Nature's way of striking the "believers"

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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by wazza » January 16, 2015, 1:36 pm

Didnt the Catholic Church oversea the killing of perhaps Millions.

Spanish Inquisition. Lucky no electronic media i suppose.

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Post by Earnest » January 16, 2015, 1:51 pm

jackspratt wrote:Quiz time.

Where do these passages come from, and are they still taken literally by the followers of that faith?
Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing (hath gone and served other gods), unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.
But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
:-k
Got to be the Old Testament, old son! :D
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Radical Islam (opinion)

Post by Earnest » January 16, 2015, 1:53 pm

ronan01 wrote:I think you mean air strikes are Nature's way of striking the "believers"
No, good buddy, I meant what I said, I think it's accurate to say they are Unbelievers of the broad culture that we as Westerners adhere to. For example, equal rights for women, etc.
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