Thailand - dangerous for farrang?

Post by **kjellsnell** » February 1, 2012, 6:26 pm

Another bad situation happen in Hua Hin and when Thai people hit ore/and kill a farrang......the police doesnt do anything about it

http://www.andrew-drummond.com/view-story.php?sid=503

Post by **BobHelm** » February 1, 2012, 6:35 pm

Depends how you live I guess....

Lived in a 20 Million baht house & he is taking a Thai tradesman to court over the disputed bill of 20,000 baht...
Sometimes it is better to put things down to experience.....

Post by **Khun Paul** » February 1, 2012, 6:41 pm

Well it depends, a long time ago I was advised to seek a Thai person to oversee builders advice i took, my contract was with him, he ensured the workers did as they were told and I paid him for expenditure. If i had a probelm it was with him, he dealt with the builders. So he got paid at the end, when i wasn;t happy i told him he knew he was not getting paid until the job was done to my satisfaction. hence a good job was done, sure i had to do some titivation myself but then I did the same in the UK as well nowt new there.

As for Thailand being dangerous for a farang ( or foreigner ) depends on where you live and what you do. me I have been attacked once following an altercation at 0300 hours, apart from that nothing, I am more scared of being in a traffic accident and of being bundled into the back of an ambulance and not arriving safely at a hospital than I am of being attacked.

Post by **jackspratt** » February 1, 2012, 6:46 pm

If you dig a bit deeper, this sort of occurrence is not unusual in Hua Hin.

2 lessons to be learned I guess:

1. don't live where it seems the farang low-life are over-represented

2. don't expect the police to actually do any policing.

Post by **harmonyudon** » February 1, 2012, 8:33 pm

Dont know other places/areas in Thailand.

Just want to say that Udon Thani is save and 'cool'

$\:D/$

Post by **Laan Yaa Mo** » February 1, 2012, 9:20 pm

It may be 'save', but is it safe, in particular, at the lower end of Thanon Adulyadej?

Post by **jai yen yen** » February 1, 2012, 11:02 pm

Thailand is very dangerous if you don't know the rules, does not matter where you are in the country. Confrontation with anyone here can be very serious. Take it easy, smile, keep calm and stay low key. Be very careful if you are doing business here, more so if it involves a lot of money. A person I know was shot for trying to sue a developer regarding his house. He did not die but is paralyzed from the neck down. Thailand can be a great place but the rules we have at our home countries do not apply here.

Post by **kjellsnell** » February 2, 2012, 8:50 am

Thanks for all the comments in this thread!
After having lived many years as an expat is my opinion on that Thailand is a high risk country to live in. If we add up the violence with traffic and other dangers as electrical installations, etc., one can directly conclude that any casual situation is a potential danger to life. Of course, one can prevent much so that you can not get into trouble but it depends not only on yourself. The risk of violence may in part be prevented and even some situations in traffic. However, still remain many risk elements that actually make everyday life to a potential danger to life. You can not prevent idiots in traffic is coming over on the wrong side and kill people, you can not prevent someone stoned Jabba madman trying to steal your hard earned money and kill / injure yourself or that you die in the shower in a hotel somewhere of an electric shock. This, together with the authorities do not seem to care about a farrang murdered or die in another way, means that a farrang life is not worth much and that the attitude of the authorities will result in more expats are murdered or die under mysterious circumstances in the future.
later last night killed four Swedish youths when they were traveling in a car from Phuket toChumpong. The murder was carried out by a truck driver who drove on the wrong side of the road. Youths died instantly along with their 26-year-old driver from Udonthani. Truck driver deviated from the site, possibly because he was under the influence of alcohol oramphetamines. He will probably not be punished for this atrocity and no one will comfortyouths sad parents or ask them to apologize for taking their children's lives. This is one of many everyday events where expats are dying unnecessarily. Along with murder and other violence, Thailand is a high risk country and farrang have to be carefull in every situation!

Post by **trubrit** » February 2, 2012, 10:09 am

Tend to agree with all that say Thailand is dangerous for many aspects of life but don't see it is any more dangerous for us than the native population. After all they use the same roads, the same lethal electricity supply and even get the same shoddy workmanship we get .The only thing that makes us more at risk is by expecting people and things to be the same as they were back in our home countries.We make it more dangerous for ourselves by this presumption. Therefore we can reduce the risk by understanding and accepting this difference. It is part of the assimilation process. If you want to live here you must first condition yourself to it.You must become Thai, blend in with the natives. Now that doesn't mean doing as they do, but accepting what they do is normal for them if not you. If you want to congregate in areas which are simply conclaves of your home countrymen you will stand out and be a potential target. Whether that's in towns like Pattaya which attract many, or nearer home in Udon, in the two predominate bar complexes, you are sticking your head up over the firing line, so of course you may become a target.As the Thai would say . It's up to you . :-"

Post by **noosard** » February 2, 2012, 11:24 am

Thailand is not a lot more dangerous than most farrang countries
I know of a owner failing to pay contactors in Oz and been made to step off 2nd floor
Alice Springs in Oz is not a safe place after dark
parts of USA I visited 20 years ago are a whole lot more dangerous than Thailand and I can only think it has got worse
LOS is still afriendly helpful place if you do the right things and smile

Post by **BobHelm** » February 2, 2012, 1:19 pm

These sort of articles rather annoy me as death is a fact of life so no one can escape it.
Newspapers & on line blogs have very little interest in the truth of a situation, they require sensationalism to get people to their pages.
Is Thailand a hugely dangerous place??
The figures would suggest that for UK visitors & residents, not, but that being elsewhere in the world could even be more statistically secure, if only minutely.

Here are Foreign and Commonwealth Office British behaviour abroad report 1 April 2008 - 31 March 2009 figures.
They suggest that the dangers of visiting or living in Thailand are minuscule - given that many of the death cases will be from natural causes & would have happened to the individual where ever they were..
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... OR2c#gid=0
If anybody wants to check the figures...

Less than one tenth of one percent of the UK visitors & residents in Thailand have a serious problem during one full year...

Post by **Aardvark** » February 2, 2012, 1:21 pm

It does seem as though Business Related People are in the fore front of these Nasty Attacks. Thai's do not like Foriegners doing business in there Country, and do not take Critisizm kindly. Sadly the Authorities see fit to turn a Blind Eye not realising what Damage it does to their Image and Overall Reputation around the World. In years to come (and I don't think too far away) when the Westerners all move else where with their Money, there will be many Thai's who will ask "What Happened" as most don't understand what they and their Countrymen are doing. We in my Country are called Racists for not wanting certain People from around the World to take to Boats and Force themselves on us and spend many years as a Burdon on the Public Purse. But show Violence of any kind toward these People, and the Full Force of the Law will come down on you. It's a Shame this Countries Leaders are so weak, or do I dare say "Stupid" that they don't start turning things around before it's too late ... just my two bobs worth ....

Post by **fatbob** » February 2, 2012, 7:29 pm

This thread is about a guy who obviously had no idea about the country he moved to and I bet came with a superior attitude to the locals. He builds an expensive house, fails to pay the contractors and gets wacked? Did he expect them to work for free and be happy about it? Did he take the cheapest quote? Did he hassle them to lower the price? He was a carpenter so he would have noticed the quality of workmanship, he should have gone and got a quality expensive joinery company to achieve the required finish he wanted, with a contract and retention clauses.

I have had a construction business in Thailand for sixteen years, we build expensive houses for foriegn clients, we have our own labour and use Thai contractors for M&E and joinery works and a constant list of Thai's for various fabrication and supply. When we issue a contract or employ a contractor we make sure our requirements are completely understood. There are the day to day headaches here, much the same as working in Aus, I was a carpenter and licensed builder there for fifteen years, I have no problem doing business here, I still enjoy working with the Thai's, I am always polite and treat them as I liked to be treated.

The only dangerous thing I find here is the roads.

Post by **kjellsnell** » February 2, 2012, 8:43 pm

coxo wrote:This thread is about a guy who obviously had no idea about the country he moved to and I bet came with a superior attitude to the locals. He builds an expensive house, fails to pay the contractors and gets wacked? Did he expect them to work for free and be happy about it? Did he take the cheapest quote? Did he hassle them to lower the price? He was a carpenter so he would have noticed the quality of workmanship, he should have gone and got a quality expensive joinery company to achieve the required finish he wanted, with a contract and retention clauses.
.

Did you find it ok for the Thai workers to kill a farrang as soon they dont agree to the bill as well?

When it comes to the bill (heavy sum) it looks like he really pay for quality workmenship....the bill looks higher then eurostandard to me!

Post by **fatbob** » February 3, 2012, 7:06 am

Kjellsnell, I made the choice to live here, I enjoy living here, if you follow the rules you dont have a problem. As I dont know the spec of his house I can say that materials cost the same here as anywhere, labour is cheaper but when they have to do it ten times it can cost more.

Post by **Ricohoc** » February 3, 2012, 7:29 am

From the first day I set foot in Thailand, I have never felt safer. I feel safer here than in my home country.

However, stupidity like walking down a dark soi at 2am after drinking too much and with 1,000 baht bills hanging out of your pockets will be just as dangerous here as anywhere. Common sense is still necessary.

Post by **rick** » February 3, 2012, 6:39 pm

well, Bob's information was interesting, but if you compare deaths with visitors/residents then Thailand easily has the highest death rate per thousand (at about 0.3 deaths/thousand for visits/residents - compared to Spain, which has about 0.01 deaths/thousand for visits/residents - i.e. you are 30 times as likely to die in Thailand. Now, that is a sobering thought. As most in Thailand are visitors, that means one in every 3,000 tourists will die during their holiday here - most probably on the roads like the poor Swedish kids in Phuket. Sky diving, canyoning and bungee jumping are pretty tame really - go to Thailand if you really want a life threatening experience.

Post by **fatbob** » February 4, 2012, 6:57 am

Its good thing we have the choice to either come or not come to Thailand, if here allready there is a thing called an airport that will take you back home. If any one feels threatened, easy dont come or simply leave! How did that song go in the Monty Python movie 'Always look on the bright side of life'.

Post by **trubrit** » February 4, 2012, 8:12 am

coxo wrote:Its good thing we have the choice to either come or not come to Thailand, if here allready there is a thing called an airport that will take you back home. If any one feels threatened, easy dont come or simply leave! How did that song go in the Monty Python movie 'Always look on the bright side of life'.

Oh how simple life could be in your world, or Monty Pythons. Whilst I don't feel in any more danger here than anywhere else in the world, neither do I have any inclination to leave, I must admit that answers like yours, literally telling people they can always FO, shows a total lack of understanding of the problems that may be involved. First of all many that may be worried about the dangers are family men , married, sometimes with young children, theirs or step related .Have possibly invested their life's savings in property here. Do you honestly think their concern is only for themselves? Of course not, possibly maybe even more for the families than their own. A plane to take them back home? You are missing the point, this is home, to them anyway. This thread appears to be a warning for them that it can be dangerous out there, and how to minimise them. Possibly to anyone thinking of coming, to be aware before making that decision . Your answer seems to be a bit like that pleasure boat captain that was first in the lifeboat . 'I'm alright jack' FO .Not very helpful .

Post by **kjellsnell** » February 4, 2012, 8:37 am

Many expats seem to ignore in the facts as they build up their new in Thailand. I myself have lived here for many years and I started this thread because I think that the violence in Thailand increased in recent years and trafiksituationen with about 9000 deaths per are speaking for themselves. Instead of an objective dialogue about the risks seem to be some angry expats as soon as the question comes up and they seem to think that I'm inexperienced. I drive a car all over Thailand, and sometimes even help to scrape up the remains of a human life from the roads. I am personally acquainted with several victims of murder and violence and react when I see that this is increasing.

Expats who have written in this thread shows utter and seem to believe that they are something special and that they have the situation under control. Objective assessment also gives me a greater chance of surviving extreme situations both in traffic and in situations where I may be exposed to violence in other ways. People who think they are on the safe side can always argue that when facing a lethal jabba fool in his own bedroom at night, or when a truck comes nose to nose with those of 100km per hour.

The thread was intended to raise a dialogue about violence risks and how best to avoid them but there is no room for it here. It will be as usual, ignorant people die without money because of violence, traffic offenses, or that they drink alcohol until they die. This happens every day and no one is interested in discussing how to OVERBUILD it, but instead refer the OP to take the first flight home - you can hardly believe it's true. I am grateful to have a good life here in Thailand but I want a good life in the future and this is done through professional (yes - i have the skill and the education) risk analysis, but it seems people do not know what it is !