Solar Power

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rjj04
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Re: Solar Power

Post by rjj04 » June 5, 2018, 12:53 pm

Central Govt. China Puts Brakes on Solar

https://www.pv-tech.org/news/china-putt ... es-imposed

Apparently the central government in China is cutting back fairly heavily on solar
deployment for the next couple of years. Cutting back about 10GW. Obviously this isn't good
news for fixing the climate, but for people interested in installing a solar power
system in Thailand it might be great news. With the US and European tariffs on solar panels, we
might see a flood of them coming our way. If the Thai government was smart it would use this
as an opportunity to get renewable power on the cheap... but TIT :)



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mortsyn
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Re: Solar Power

Post by mortsyn » June 7, 2018, 4:45 pm


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rjj04
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Re: Solar Power

Post by rjj04 » June 8, 2018, 9:55 am

"Private solar power buying gets go-ahead"

Summary of article: *** Same BS different day. ***
- "No solid time frame yet" :)
- "Need time to workout details of program" ;) As if years and years of "studying" the issue to date, and countless models of how to do it existing outside of Thailand, aren't enough for them to figure it out... like it's quantum mechanics on steroids or something.
- Selling price "up to 2.44THB" In other words, you sell power to PEA at 2.44THB, if your lucky, then they take your electrons and sell them to your neighbour for 3.9THB (making an instant profit of 60%... in normal discourse that would be deemed a scam). Also, anybody who uses the term "up to" when advertising pricing ought to be summarily shot on the spot!!!

Get rid of the monopoly of PEA/MEA NOW!! I wonder who in Thailand owns most of the shares of PEA/MEA??? Hmmmm let me guess. :-k

glalt
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Re: Solar Power

Post by glalt » June 8, 2018, 11:01 am

No way could I have a system large enough to sell the surplus to the power company. I have far too many mature trees. Just a bit of shade kills the panel output. Even at that, I looked closely at the requirements. I found that the "APPROVED" components were horribly overpriced. Makes one wonder who approves those components. How much does it cost the approved component manufacturers for the approval? I would guess that it is the middlemen and not the manufactures who are able to get approved.

It would be interesting to see who owns solar farms that have long term contracts selling power for good profits. A ten year contract should easily pay for the installation.

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fhorst
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Re: Solar Power

Post by fhorst » July 10, 2018, 7:53 am

Many posts about solar...

Many :-)

For me, I have not an other option.
My (new to build) home is 3km away to the electricity grid.
I like to use, looking at the possible costs, it ain't funny.

I can buy panels local, about 3500 Baht per 300W polycrystalline

Bigger problem is storage for night.

Are there working alternatives for lead acid and LIFEPO4?
Salt water looked nice, it will not be available any time soon.

LIFEPO4 is to expensive for me.

I like to know some really possible alternatives to store and use about 100.000ah. At 48v

Thanks!
If it can't be done, it never happened..

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Re: Solar Power

Post by JR » January 1, 2019, 10:06 pm

fhorst has not posted since July so I do not know how relevant this is now. We had similar position when we built three years ago. Over a km to nearest connection and a ludicrous offer from PEA. We are now off-grid with panels and batteries. No problems at all. Has been running over a year now.

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Re: Solar Power

Post by glalt » January 2, 2019, 7:55 pm

I have been using three small solar systems, the oldest for more than ten years. The first system I built I used Used 4 65 AH AGM sealed batteries. Those batteries lasted about five years. the second system used two FB brand 12 volt 125 AH deep cycle lead acid batteries. Amazingly enough they are still working fine after about 10 years. The third system is using 4 6 volt 125 AH golf cart batteries. They are only a few years old so I have no idea how long they will last. All systems are set up for 12 volts. The only problem I see with regular deep cycle lead acid batteries is that they need to be well ventilated to prevent dangerous hydrogen build up. I check the acid level no more often than once a month. The bottom line is there will be no more very expensive sealed AGM batteries for me. I think common deep cycle lead acid batteries give the best bang for the baht. Maybe I should add that I never discharge my batteries below 50 percent.

I'm a firm believer in a number of smaller systems each running their own circuits. If one component fails, you still have power to manipulate between circuits. A friend of mine had a very large system. He had many problems with charge controllers and one huge inverter. He was off the grid so when he had a problem, he had no power. I keep a spare charge controller and a spare inverter. Other than frying one inverter because of my own stupidity, I have had no problems. My AliExpress Chinese components have been very dependable.

I did have one problem with a new 1,500 watt Gaia inverter. It gave a puff of white smoke and quit working. Gaia asked me to take the cover off and send them pictures. (leaking capacitor) They immediately sent me a replacement without asking me to send the defective one back. I am using three Gaia inverters.

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parrot
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Re: Solar Power

Post by parrot » May 24, 2019, 3:52 pm

Some news on the private sale of solar power back to the government:
https://spv.mea.or.th/
http://www.energynewscenter.com/%E0%B9% ... nP28bg1lgc
Interested parties can apply now through Dec 2019.

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Re: Solar Power

Post by glalt » May 27, 2019, 9:36 am

Grid tie inverters are obviously not the answer. When the main grid goes down, the grid tie inverters go down also. Besides that, you have to deal with the government to get the system approved to get paid for the output.

The main problem is still storing the power to supply electricity overnight. I just built another small system to power three WiFi cameras and emergency lighting near my garage. The cameras need power to work and when the unreliable grid goes down, they go off also and need to be reset when the power comes back on. I used the best components because I wanted to set it up and forget it. By far the most expensive component was the 100 AH gel battery. It cost half of the total cost at 7,000 baht.

The system is oversize for the power needed but better too big than too small. I have a 165 watt mono solar panel, a 10 amp MPPT solar charger, a 500 watt GAIA inverter and of course the expensive battery. My WiFi router for the Internet is in the house and also solar powered. It all runs 24/7.

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maaka
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Re: Solar Power

Post by maaka » May 27, 2019, 1:35 pm

finally after years of planning, and hauling suitcase full of solar bits and pieces from the homeland, I put together my own wee 12v solar power unit for emergency lighting..we loose village power every other day, and candles and torches were a pain..so after tracking down some lengths of alloy angle iron, to screw the panels too that I lugged from NZ in my trusty suitcase, I clambered onto the roof and must have put a dent in it with every step I took, bloody thin stuff it is..would have slide off if it wasnt for the aide of a young fella to hold onto the rope around me guts..with bits of rubber from a gumboot to do as washers, she was secured to the roof and the wires poked thru the wall into the ceiling..then mounted my home made meter board to the wall in the garage, and thus after having pre wired the lights and mounted them in different rooms, we poked them up thru the ceiling, and sent young fella into the dark hotness to gather them all up and jam them down the hole in ceiling above meter board. I then instructed the large joval electrician, father of young fella, to screw what wire where due to my failing eye sight. A long procedure but done from memory, as this is my fourth solar unit..once all was neatly done and squared away, the battery and then the panels were attached and we waited with baited breath, until the main switch was thrown, and nothing..abit of a ponder, and then set the Controller, and then woof, or poof, on came the lights..ohh merriment and wonderous joy, that another of my ideas had worked..there I was next morn well before the sparrow farts, supping chalon in the kitchen when the village power went down...dont panic. One merely throws this switch and the house is lite up like Xmas..hoo ya
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rick
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Re: Solar Power

Post by rick » May 27, 2019, 2:03 pm

Well done!

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maaka
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Re: Solar Power

Post by maaka » May 27, 2019, 3:59 pm

Thanks Mate...its only small fry...2x 40 panels, 40 ah acid battery, 30a Controller, left room to add another panel, for 12v music, water pump etc..will replace Controller with a new one I bought downunder, as it has two USB ports for cell phone charging, or other 5v things..

making small changes for the future, own power own water, ..wandered around with a couple of metal rods the other day, and found water near the house, bored down to finally find it at 60m.

glalt
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Re: Solar Power

Post by glalt » May 27, 2019, 4:28 pm

I may not live long enough for my systems to pay for themselves, BUT, when the neighborhood goes black, I still have electricity. My router and computer just keep working like nothing happened. Yes, I have spent a lot of money but at least for me, it is worth every baht. I just spent 1,850 baht for a new AVR for the farm generator. I still need to get the one at the house repaired.

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parrot
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Re: Solar Power

Post by parrot » June 1, 2019, 2:06 pm

I've seen this company's truck in/around town a few times. Although from Khonkaen, they apparently do work in Udon. From their website:
"Solartech Center Ltd., Solartech Center Ltd., located at 166 Moo 1, Ban Khok Subdistrict, Nong Na Kham District, Khon Kaen 40150. We are the importer and distributor of solar cell solar panels, solar panels. At the cheapest price What we consider most is Product quality As well as customer satisfaction Under the cheaper price than the general market We import and produce products that are legal. We focus on being a reliable online store and selling products. At the most reasonable price, our products are high quality products compared to the price. Rest assured in the quality system RoHS, CE and ISO9001 accepted worldwide. We are a distribution center. Solar energy Cheap solar cell solar cell panels that you can trust in quality and price. All products of our shop are guaranteed for 1 year. "
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Re: Solar Power

Post by Gudon » June 5, 2019, 6:11 pm

Hi
I know this is an old thread but I am seriously considering a solar/pea system in Udon and would be great to meet you and learn some basics
Gordon

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fhorst
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Re: Solar Power

Post by fhorst » November 17, 2019, 8:39 am

Sorry for the late response...

About solar :-)
Yes we/I have
Whooping 27 X 330w panels. Good start quality.
And price is low (3.300 THB)
We bought in 3 different times, as we know the shop from online store... Better safe then sorry.
Transport price 500 THB per 2 panels.
Total costs was 95.850 THB

The lady is friendly, can read good English (reply in Thai)
https://www.9solarcell.com/

We also purchased our batteries there.
Again, a whooping 3.200ah (at 12v)
Lol
16 X 200ah Globatt deep cycle solar batteries.
Type "Pace" again, really good price: 7700 TH BHB
Setup in 4*4= 48v with 800ah, total of about 35kwh (= use 35 hours 1000w power)
(Not to advice as 90% discharge will shorten lifespan!!)
(also purchased in batches)

Transport costs per battery where 200 baht.
Batteries are new production, not long shelved.

For solar panels, you never know till after 15 years.
All I can say is that the horror stories of really bad panels haven't been around for over a decade.
Most panels are good quality.

Batteries is always difficult and different story.
Your storage temperature, your DOD (do you discharge deep or shallow), do you do absorption stage Avery few months?

For me, I have separate room for batteries, it have crazy good insulation and own air-conditioning..

The investment, 16 *7900= 126.400THB is worth protecting.
According to internet (even Wikipedia)
Battery live goes half per 5 degrees up, starting at 20.
@ 20c, +5 years
@ 25c + 3
@ 30c + 1.5
@ 35c +1 year.
That is enough difference to make the air-conditioning a good investment.
Spend every 2 or every 5 years 125k THB.....


My MPPT are 3 x 60A POWMR. From China, AliExpress.
About 75 USD each. They are loud (small fan) but work quite good.

For inverters, I'm not so lucky.

I bought 2* 6kw GaiaDefender (AliExpress) 600 USD each, include transport.
They are quality build, and give clean energy (not a lot distortion)
Sadly it have 1 ventilator. And that quality, while this brand (NMB) normally only high quality products, they fail. A lot.
Also, heat management problem, with low loads, under 500w, the Ventilator does not start at all.

3 times send back to China for repairs (repair free, costs 300usd for transport and tax (yes pay tax always) And one time repair myself.
Even bought extra one for spare / hot swap..

I decided that this have to stop.
I've got one "working" left (give between 180 and 190v) the rest is burned.

Now I'm looking at combination unit (MPPT and Inverter) as it can give good feedback on power production and usage.
Maybe 2 * 3.2kw "Revo II" :
https://www.soropower.com/products/Inverter/7/696.html
About 1100 for 2 incl. WiFi, parallel and nice phone app.
Or a real proffecional looking one:
https://www.mppsolar.com/v3/mpi-hybrid-series-2/
(The 5kw unit.)
About 1400 USD for the 5kw inc. WiFi

5 KW is on the low side.
It would require power usage management.
Our submersible pump draws 2.5kw.
It doesn't run all day, only a few times a few minutes to top up the 1500l tank.
Unless we need many water for irrigation.

With half left.. there is not much room for the rest.
(5* 9000btu/540w air-conditioning, refrigerator, and all other small stuff)

Not sure yet.
I keep you guys posted.

My batteries stay full, only shallow discharge at night and are fully recharged at noon.

They are polycrystal panels, on clouded days each panel still deliver about 50watts.

And, coming from Holland, (land of the mills and tulip) we have 4 small wind turbine 800w each.

Commercial controllers need too high wind speeds to start, I'm building my own MPPT wind turbine controller now. Adruino based.
(You can Google, and find. Developed by Frenchman, Phillipe.)

All parts come from China, they take long time to arrive.
Phillipe's results are promising.
If it can't be done, it never happened..

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Re: Solar Power

Post by glalt » November 17, 2019, 10:51 am

I now have four small solar systems. The largest using four 250 watt poly panels and four 225 AH 6 volt golf cart batteries connected to give twelve volts. All the systems have been amazingly trouble free. One GAIA 1,500 watt inverter failed and it was replaced immediately with no need to return the one that failed. I use four GAIA inverters. All my charge controllers are EP Solar MPPT Tracers and none have failed. I use only twelve volt systems because many things like my security system, router and light bulbs run on twelve volts and are connected directly to the battery banks.

I'm of the opinion that multiple small systems are better than a single large system because spares are cheap and if a system does fail, I still have some power. I do have a spare charge controller and inverter. Fortunately, even after all these years I have not needed the spares except for one inverter that I used until the defective GAIA was replaced. Charge controllers and inverters were all purchased through AliExpress and batteries and panels were purchased locally.

Maybe I should add that I never found Internet recommendations as far as sizing components to be accurate. I have double the panels recommended and they are able to keep the batteries charged on rainy or cloudy days. My inverters are also double sized because I have found that running inverters near maximum output causes them to get hot. I also have a small computer fan mounted below my largest system charge controller because it too was getting hot. According to the "experts" oversize components are not as efficient. I am more interested in long life rather than optimum efficiency.

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fhorst
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Re: Solar Power

Post by fhorst » November 17, 2019, 8:43 pm

:-)

I couldn't agree more.
My system is also highly over capacity.
This to ensure long life.

4 lines of 4 12v batteries parallel and series give the same redundancy as 4 separate system.

Same goes for my original 2* GAIA, later 3*.
Sadly the 6000w unit is not as lasting as it's smaller brothers.

My 3* 60A MPPT also provide the Redundancy,

This is why I'm little "scared" to choose the high quality looking 28kg 5kw unit.
What if it fails?

I tried today to build with 2 scrapped GAIA to make a working one.
Tomorrow I can test.

I really hope it will work!
Makes me less worried to buy the bulky 5kw or the 2* 3.2kw.

Why still one system?
I really like to know our real usage and production.
And, how our battery array is holding up.

16* 200ah really should be enough.
And most days it truely is.
Some days.. I go below 40% (I made warning system that beeps)
And I like to get a grasp on what and why.

Monitoring software will give this information.

Pricing between 1 and 1500 USD is ok.
The big brother of 10kw is 2300.. (45kg)
I'm not a poor man, there are limits :-)
If I choose the 5kw, o can always decide to do parallel with additional unit.
If it can't be done, it never happened..

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Re: Solar Power

Post by glalt » November 17, 2019, 9:28 pm

When my 1,500 watt inverter failed, GAIA replaced it quickly and didn't ask me to send the defective one back. I went ahead and replaced the blown capacitor and hoped for it to work. It didn't work. Apparently that was not the only problem. I then salvaged some things and the fan runs 24/7 cooling a charge controller. I still have more fans from scrapped computers. Yes, I'm somewhat of a pack rat.

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kopkei
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Re: Solar Power

Post by kopkei » November 18, 2019, 9:49 am

when i read all this over solar power , i still do not see the advantages by investing in such an expensive exploit that will give you a lot headache about repairs and defects and will not give you any profit compared to your normal electric bill?
please enlighten me on this one ?.... :-k

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