Seat Belt Law coming into effect

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stattointhailand
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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by stattointhailand » August 11, 2022, 2:12 pm

Why is it that they always manage to come up with this law, and change that law to try to improve Thailands abysmal road traffic record, when every man Jack can see that making one law (and enforcing it) would rocket them up the world road safety list ............ BAN ANYONE FROM TRAVELING IN THE BACK OF A PICK UP ........... road traffic deaths cut immediately :confused:



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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by jackspratt » August 11, 2022, 2:16 pm

That is already the law, if you are referring to the pickup tray.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by tamada » August 11, 2022, 2:43 pm

Same same Texas, no? Can't carry anyone in the back on I45, around Arlington or down Westheimer. But way, way out there in Lubbock, or Longview or Paris...

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by Khun Paul » August 12, 2022, 6:44 am

Well NEWS , the RTP have stated publically that they will be gentle in their approach in enforcing this LAW, however asa always it is down to each individual OFFGICER to impose fines as he sees fit or at his discretion.
I will say up to now recently the RTP have been very quiet in Fine allocating and generally well behaved in when and how they enfoprce many laws, but this is a Red rag to a Bull, I can see officers seeing the Baht signs shining, as everyone is subject to the fines, each adult and the driver presumably paying for children.

What the RTP statement also shows is that the RTP all 250000 plus have no clue on how to enforce this law, I propose that Insurance Companied invoke a No cover rule if people die or are injured who are NOT wearing a seat belt.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by stattointhailand » August 12, 2022, 10:45 am

I think Insurance companies have enough "Get Out clauses" already, they dont need any new ones.

What actually is "an act of god" which God? How? Prove it if you want to claim it !!

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by Potamoi » August 13, 2022, 10:47 am

Yes, the coppers will likely see it as an opening for more cash fines.
Yes, it will be difficult to enforce but perhaps my glass is half full when I think it's a good start.

It is possible the Grab and Taxi drivers might just dig the safety belts out of the back seats for their customers to comply? I know I spend time doing it in many cases.

Things are heading in the right direction as far as I am concerned. It may be a few years before habits take over for fines but at least now I am not the only bad guy demanding passengers belt up when I drive.



Some of the Australian Road Safety Campaign videos from the 70's and 80's were rebroadcast in the 2000's and quite effective in my opinion.
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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by tamada » August 13, 2022, 2:12 pm

Got to agree it's overdue and all for the better especially digging those rear seatbelts out. However, based on a history of their not milking the uninsured and/or untaxed motorist to any great extent, I don't think the cops will make any extra effort to spot-check for seatbelts. They're too darn lazy. Maybe the odd back-seat violation will be "ticketed" when they stop a car for something else like running a red light but otherwise, the easy, fast money is still to be made on motorcycle helmet shakedowns and booze check traffic stops. The new, sky-high rates for dodging the latter, as recently intimated by DM, should keep them focused on the fast and easy baht for now.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by parrot » August 13, 2022, 3:19 pm

I may be missing something.....but the cops (here/there) don't write the laws. Speed limit laws, driving with expired license/plates, drink driving, child safety seats/seat belts, chucking Snickers wrappers out your window......the cops enforce the laws written by other government agencies. I'm with Potamoi......roll back the US calendar 50/60 years and we did all the abhorable things that Thais do today.....including mob rule in major cities and tossing hazardous chemicals in our rivers. There are lots of things that I dislike about life in Thailand (not enough to tip the balance).......but not enough to remove the tint on my prescription glasses.
Can anyone who's been here for say 10-20 years honestly say that driving here isn't safer than back then? I drive past police checkpoints most every day (I'm sure hundreds of times)......kilo 9 or kilo 5 going into town from NWS......I've never been stopped or paid a fine there. I have paid a few fines over the years at other locations for clear violations. I wouldn't ask a cop here where the money goes anymore than I'd ask a cop back in the US where the $300 for a speeding ticket goes. You get caught breaking a law, you pay a fine. Simple.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by jackspratt » August 13, 2022, 3:48 pm

IMO there are a couple of what I believe are flaws in your arguments, parrot.

Firstly, the negative things we (being developed countries such as the US and Oz) did 50 or 60 years were not recognised as such at that time, but once they were identified, steps were taken to remedy them. And appropriate enforcement, together with education of the public, lead to a discernable change.

So the problems are well known, and the Thai government has progressively done its bit in passing appropriate traffic laws.

Where it continues to break down, despite the acknowledged small improvements, is in the enforcement. The Thai government has given them the powers, and the cops continue to ignore them. And while they do, there is no incentive for the general public to change their habits - much as we didn't 50 or 60 years ago until we had to.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by tamada » August 13, 2022, 4:12 pm

I stilI agree with parrot that driving here is far safer than it was when my landing craft broached the morning surf on Patong Beach in late 1978.

The country and the people are making progress (despite the police and certain other unspeakable things).

Now, where did I leave my saffron-tinted glasses?
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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by parrot » August 13, 2022, 5:00 pm

While I wouldn't condone 4 people on a motorcycle back in the US, here.......when a family doesn't have the means for a Dodge Caravan or 4 separate motorcycles, it's easier to digest.
Some countries, like Singapore, Australia, UK, Germany have tough gun laws........but that hasn't deterred the US from allowing their citizens to arm themselves to the teeth. I like to think that at some point the future, US citizens are going to look back and say, "What the f... were my parents/grandparents thinking?"
For all we know about how helmets reduce motorcycle deaths, we still have states in the US that don't require motorcyclists to wear helmets. That makes it easy to ID what states certain expats in Thailand come from.

I'll be interested to hear the reports of fines levied once police start enforcing the new law. That just reminded me of the day I was on Taharn Rd, just up from the statue circle. I popped into a 7-11, got back into the truck and pulled out into traffic AS I was putting on my seatbelt. My luck, a traffic cop was right there.....waved me over and I had to pay 400 Baht. Nothing much for me to complain about.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by fdimike » August 13, 2022, 5:04 pm

The primary problem with parrot's argument is the near total lack of enforcement of traffic laws. I kind of liken the traffic cops here to "little ghosts" if I can borrow a term for Thai's illegally working in Korea as well as Singapore. I've been on the road that Parrot mentioned numerous times over the past several years and have only seen the traffic cops out once - yesterday as they were setting up one of their useless roadblocks just after the 3 way intersection coming into town. More importantly is their (cops) total lack of active enforcement of the traffic laws. I'm sure everyone has been at an intersection waiting for the light to change while NUMEROUS motorcyclists without a helmet and carrying 3 or 4 passengers que up right next to a traffic cops who totally ignores the situation. How about the cars, trucks and motorcyclists driving in the wrong direction or making a U-turn at a red traffic light? A friend of mine correctly calls them "salmon". I personally like the motorcyclist who carry a helmet in their basket or on the handlebar. Lots of common sense displayed there with a total lack of concern for the traffic laws. Why trouble yourself abiding by the law when there is no law enforcement to correct your behavior. To answer Parrot's question about road safety today vs say 10-20 years ago. It's absolutely worse today here in Udon. Way more vehicles, poor roads and no law enforcement to speak of. I can take that back to 1970 as well.
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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by rick » August 15, 2022, 10:17 pm

As said, hard to believe that enforcement will happen. On the other hand, seat belt laws are ambiguous - have to wear one in a car or truck, but not available on a bus.... that's true for the UK as well. As for travelling in the back of a pickup, probably safer than riding a motorbike! (assuming the truck is in reasonable working order and not speeding). I would actually legalise it with the proviso of a maximum speed limit of say 40 kph.
I also agree with Parrot that for many poorer Thai families putting the family on one motor bike is the only real option. No excuse for not wearing helmets though.

Are the roads safer these days? Yes and No. Many roads now better quality than 10-15 years ago, more crash barriers, lighting etc. - Now the increased number of vehicles can go faster with the predictable results. Generally, driving standards are now slightly better, but still appalling compared to European countries. On the school run every morning, i could easily flatten half a dozen motorbikes if i followed the Thai "I'm bigger than you, get out of my way!" rule. Also would have rounded off the car corners and dented the radiator grill on the other cars and trucks pulling out in front of me without indication.

I just follow the rule that you assume all other road users here are trying to kill you (or at least get money off you), and also i drive in kilometres per hour the same number that i would drive in miles per hour in the UK (i.e. at 2/3rds the speed). So far 12 years driving here and no accidents other than the car being bumped when i wasn't moving! (no real damage done).
It probably helps that my first experience of driving pickups was in the desert in Libya (a country in the top half a dozen for road deaths for the last 50 years) - when i was told driving in Thailand was to dangerous to do, I thought '?' - "no worse than Libya!"

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by tamada » August 16, 2022, 8:00 am

Keep in mind that despite the improved highways with all the passive safety mechanisms and the higher volumes of traffic on them, it's the casual or careless or inexperienced or drunk or otherwise unfortunate 2-wheeler(s) on back lanes, side sois and rural roads that still constitutes over 80% of the fatalities.

Seatbelts?

Meh...
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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by Khun Paul » August 16, 2022, 1:15 pm

Twas always the case, more accidents and deaths happen on residential Roads , although lower speeds, it is the fallacy that local roads are safer, hence concentration is far lower, familiarity breeds contempt , and although at 100KPH you are constantly looking out for the unexpected at 40 kph you ride/drive around assuming it will be okay .

Sadly the opposite is true but no matter what you say about it, here even that message has not got through to anyone who has the authority to change anything , and lets face it, Thais maintain they are SUCH GOOD drivers to try to change them is fools errand.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by Udon Map » August 16, 2022, 1:48 pm

Khun Paul wrote:
August 16, 2022, 1:15 pm
Twas always the case, more accidents and deaths happen on residential Roads, although lower speeds....
Reminds me of the Public Service Announcement ads on TV in the U.S. when seat belts were first being installed on cars. "75% of all car accidents occur within 25 miles of the home."

Well, sure, but that's because 75% of all driving occurs within 25 miles of the home.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by parrot » August 16, 2022, 2:03 pm

Sometime back in the latter 1980's, the Air Force was buckling down on seat belt violators on their bases in the US. If someone you supervised was cited for not wearing a seat belt on base, YOU and the individual were called into the bosses office. Nothing seemed to work.....and unannounced seat belt checks hovered around 60-70% compliance. Then, the AF announced that if you were involved in an accident and weren't wearing your seat belt, you'd be liable for medical costs....versus the military covering them. It seemed like overnight, compliance was above 80%. I don't know if the threat was an empty one.........but it seemed to work at the base where I was stationed.

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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by fdimike » August 16, 2022, 4:55 pm

I faced the same thing while stationed at Aviano AB around 1975/76. I was stopped by the security police while entering the base and told to buckle up or else I would be facing a meeting with my commander. Worked for me and I've never operated a vehicle without using my seat belt no matter where I lived after that. The seat belt saved my life in a head on collision in Florida. I was involved as a passenger in a pickup truck which overturned here in Udon. I was suspended upside down and held that way until emergency personnel freed me and took me to the hospital in Ampher Phen with no injuries. Yes I'm a firm believer in buckling up.
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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by mak » August 16, 2022, 5:17 pm


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Re: Seat Belt Law coming into effect

Post by Khun Paul » August 16, 2022, 5:58 pm

There is a downside to these Seat Belt laws, imposed on the unwilling drivers and passengers.there are a lot less Organs to transplant or even donate as less people are DYING .

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