Sin-sod

Thai Society and culture, Living in Thailand.
lee
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Sin-sod

Post by lee » August 9, 2009, 12:45 pm

Sin-sod
by Steve Graham © Udonmap.com
Magazine Issue 9

Sin-sod can best be explained as a form of dowry. In its purest form, it is given to the bride’s parents for the loss of the daughter from the family home and more recently, it tends to be given back as a present to the happy couple. This is a tradition that has gone on for many years and was normally conducted by elders from each family in a very discreet way. There would be talk about how fertile the land was and the “bride-price” was decided by asking “How loud the thunder was,” and the answer could be something like, “Ten Thousand.” Of course, over the years this practice has become more and more distorted, with amounts of one million baht being bantered about.

For those Thais who were brought up in Bangkok, the tradition of sin-sod is something deemed more for those people who live up country. There are many Thais who live in Bangkok who are from the Isaan region of Thailand and still believe in sin-sod as part of the wedding ceremony. I was married a long time ago, so inflation has taken its toll and society has changed; however, there are still many places that continue to adopt this custom today.

I can’t remember how much I paid, but I do remember it being in the range of 13,000 baht plus. The number was a strange number. By tradition, it is usually an even number and when I asked why it was this specific number, I was told it was lucky. Lucky for whom? I didn’t feel very lucky paying it out; however, my wife was not insistent on even having a traditional Thai wedding, so I thought it was the least I could do seeing as we were getting married after all.

My parents came from England for my Thai wedding and were part of the ceremony. I remember when it came to the handing over of the sin-sod, I whispered to my mum, “Well, that’s it, bought and paid for,” which resulted in a discreet punch to the ribs. Call me a coward, but since then I have never knelt down in front of my mother again.

Sometimes, with the sin sod comes a request for gold. This I find very disturbing as traditionally I am not the most generous of people and the idea of family members wearing large “bling blings” filled me with horror. Luckily I was able to talk my way out of that one; however, impending husbands need to be aware that the sin-sod and gold seem to go hand in hand these days and a small rural wedding may well cost you an arm and a leg once all the expenses have been added up.

Bearing in mind the tradition of sin sod, it is not a bad thing; however, if the talk of this subject takes precedence over everything else at your impending wedding, I would seriously think twice about what you were about to do. I paid the price and the only pain I suffered was dished out by my mother.



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aznyron
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by aznyron » August 9, 2009, 3:06 pm

=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
well written post now let me ad my opinion sin sod is a personal choice. if you choose to give it or not.
and the amount should be taken very seriously if you chose to give. just remember when you marry a Thai Girl in some cases you marry the family and wind up supporting Momma & Poppa by giving them a monthly allowance another choice that you have to make seriously. I will not tell you what to do I know what I did
but that may not work for others I paid nothing and I give nothing that was my choice but in all fairness I was never ask to pay any thing by my wife or her family also my wife's Parents were deceased before I met her which also gave me the edge. and it is my understanding if the lady in questioned was married before no sin sod is required same hold true if she has children

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by Marmite The Dog » August 9, 2009, 5:01 pm

Maybe we should have a poll? "How much did your wife cost?" And the follow up thread, "Was she worth it?". :|

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by old-timer » August 9, 2009, 5:06 pm

Marmite The Dog wrote:Maybe we should have a poll? "How much did your wife cost?" And the follow up thread, "Was she worth it?". :|
10k to the old man and 10k to the old lady - my wife is an old slapper... \:D/..and very worth it.... \:D/

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by beer monkey » August 9, 2009, 6:27 pm

A bargain Old T. :mrgreen:
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by plien » August 10, 2009, 3:01 pm

Sin Sod be or not to be... I have no problem with Sin Sod if realistic figures are applied. It`s what comes after, that I`m more interested in.
Long term agenda of the family? Who am I supposed to support regularly and on occasion? Parents or every other relative that happen to have an accident?
Who will my new wife side with when these matters come up? Me and her new family or old family?
Not easy to deal with if I am in love and blinded by all the smiles.
Opinions and experiences most welcome, Plien

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by arjay » August 10, 2009, 3:16 pm

Talking of "sin sodt", some of the women I've seen around should be paying the man to take them on! ;)

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aznyron
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by aznyron » August 10, 2009, 3:41 pm

arjay wrote:Talking of "sin sodt", some of the women I've seen around should be paying the man to take them on! ;)
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[-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X [-X :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by beer monkey » August 10, 2009, 3:54 pm

I didn't take you for a Bernard Manning type of comedy man Arjay...i am surprised.. :lol:

Have you got any good mother-in-law jokes..?
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plien
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by plien » August 10, 2009, 4:12 pm

Oh, somehow I missed your reply to the OP aznyron.
Made my post superfluous... :oops:
:-" Plien

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by SanukJoe » August 10, 2009, 4:53 pm

A couple of years ago this was an explosive subject on Thai visa resulting in verbal abuse and personal insults.
I hope this will not happen here.

Sin sod is often misunderstood and those who pay sin sod are called losers.

Just a few facts:

Sin sod is NOT a dowry! If you are an Indian man and see a lovely girl you talk to her father and if both of you agree on the money to be paid the girl is yours, that is a dowry.
Sin sod has nothing to do with buying your future wife nor with getting permission to marry from her parents. You can marry without even talking about sin sod, it just could bring your TW in problem with her family.

Sin sod is also paid by Thai men, not just farang.

I have more facts but running out of time now :oops:

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plien
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by plien » August 10, 2009, 5:19 pm

Thank you Joe
I have read the tread on Sin Sod. It made me thinking that, maybe it your not asked to pay Sin Sod it might be a surprise later on when you realize what`s expected from you in the long run.
Hence my post above.
Plien

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by beer monkey » August 10, 2009, 5:33 pm

A couple of years ago this was an explosive subject on Thai visa resulting in verbal abuse and personal insults.
Thats Forums for you....we have plenty of that here. :boogle:
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by BKKSTAN » August 10, 2009, 5:47 pm

I think ,as somebody already said,that sinsod is a personal choice!

But my question is why does the Thai culture take precedent over the falangs culture in a relationship?In other words just because one is marrying into a different culture,so is she :lol:

There was never a discussion about sinsod in our relationship! :D

laphanphon

Re: Sin-sod

Post by laphanphon » August 10, 2009, 7:10 pm

Do a search 'sin sod' and you'll come up with a few threads on the subject. personally, i'm against the idea and custom of sin sod. anyone i have married or lived with had/have everything they need or should want, along with secure retirement, if that's not enough.......NEXT.......did not and would not pay for any reason. NEXT........ 8) as far as the responsibilities or suggestion of supporting their extended family, they survived before i got here, and will survive after i'm gone............they are not my responsibility or even hers. we have enough money for our healthy retiremnt. hopefully i'll squeeze 15-20 more, meaning and extra 20 for her, so any and all funds are for that, our retirement and future health bills, which, since we haven't got a crystal ball to forecast, i'm not wasting any on anyone except us, simply because i don't know if we will need it ourselves in the future. if all goes well, no major surprises, expensive health issues, and the little one doesn't turn into an a-hole, she should be sitting pretty good herself.

giving their loved ones, and that's a stretch, a better life is worth more than any sin sod, especially if all things considered fairly, sin sot same as thai/thai relationship. village virgin farm gal to thai suitor, 30-50 K baht, 100K tops. anything else i would consider a scamming and wasted funds. IMHO.

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by Fawn » August 11, 2009, 2:18 am

Marmite The Missus wrote:Maybe we should have a poll? "How much did your wife cost?" And the follow up thread, "Was she worth it?". :|
Ooh, that's a wee bit naughty Jase. I agree with Sanuk Joe, just hope this one doesn't degenerate into insults.
Doug! Doug! Doug!

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by saint » August 11, 2009, 5:03 am

lets look at this from a thai point of view . there are no pensions , social security , and poor health services in thailand . thais in rural poorer areas tend to have more children , these children are expected to contribute to the family budget later in life , and support their aging parents . very similar situation to the western world years ago , when we did not look to the government or state for any help later in life . when a thai girl marries , she tends to leave her family , and joins her husbands family . therfore her family have lost an asset , an asset that would of contributed to the family financialy or with her labour . she may very well still give her own parents finacial help , but her husbands family would take presidence . i see sin sot as a kind of compensation for reducing her families assets . now , as in my case , had the family invested heavily in the girls education , and made numerous sacrifices to send their child to university , to put them in a better position in the market place , job wise , to generate a better income for not only the child , but the entire family . they , the family have lost a considerable investment . so to all of you who think of sin sot as a scam , think on it as a business or investment . by marrying their daughter , you are stripping them of an asset , for which they should be reinbursed . :-k :-k :-k

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Re: Sin-sod

Post by beer monkey » August 11, 2009, 5:17 am

What about the Hi-so weddings...millions of baht and Gold are on display...they surely don't need it.
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by Laan Yaa Mo » August 11, 2009, 5:20 am

Khun Saint, when you are not bleary-eyed from a lack of sleep, or fresh from a rampage murdering small insects and creatures in gardens, or burning down the houses of neighbours, you can make a lot of sense.

We had a huge rain storm replete with thunder and lightning last night in Toronto too. Not easy to sleep through that even if it was nine at night.

Well, take it easy, don't go ballistic and harm the animals, or tease the wife by pouring ice-cold water on her whilst she sleeps and you squirm.
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Re: Sin-sod

Post by pompui » August 11, 2009, 7:39 am

saint wrote:lets look at this from a thai point of view . there are no pensions , social security , and poor health services in thailand . thais in rural poorer areas tend to have more children , these children are expected to contribute to the family budget later in life , and support their aging parents . very similar situation to the western world years ago , when we did not look to the government or state for any help later in life . when a thai girl marries , she tends to leave her family , and joins her husbands family . therfore her family have lost an asset , an asset that would of contributed to the family financialy or with her labour . she may very well still give her own parents finacial help , but her husbands family would take presidence . i see sin sot as a kind of compensation for reducing her families assets . now , as in my case , had the family invested heavily in the girls education , and made numerous sacrifices to send their child to university , to put them in a better position in the market place , job wise , to generate a better income for not only the child , but the entire family . they , the family have lost a considerable investment . so to all of you who think of sin sot as a scam , think on it as a business or investment . by marrying their daughter , you are stripping them of an asset , for which they should be reinbursed . :-k :-k :-k
=D>Well put, I always took the same view Saint, with the exception of course that if your loved one has been married before, with or without kids,a sinsodt would have been paid and therefore the family cannot use here like some form of reusable product :evil: I have seen the amounts similar to LA has quoted for Thai/Thai weddings and I of course fell within the higher limit for Thai/Farang.
As BM says sinsodt is not necessarily done with the rich Thais,it is done for show and passed back.
If someone wants to give money despite it not being required then up to you but it is not then sinsodt number 2 8)

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