Going with the flow can get frustrating at times

[pf-flyer]

Earlier this year during the planting season my wife was talking with her brother in-law while he was adding grease to the bearings in his two bottom plow that we just bought for him several weeks previously so that he would be able to plow the rice paddies. I mentioned to my wife that he was just adding grease to a bearing that I observed was full of dirt and grit. I mentioned to my wife that he should pull that bearing out and flush the grit and dirt out before he adds any grease. My wife said not to say anything because his is the head of the house and he might take offense if we say anything. I replied that I took two years of auto mechanics training at a vocational technical school. I can show your brother in-law how to clean and repack that bearing so that it will last a long time. She said not to say anything. I said OK. .......
He called my wife yesterday and he told her that he needed new bearings. ...I chose not to say anything and I am also not going to be obligated to purchase any replacement bearings for him either ....: )

[Aardvark]

Thai "Face" as usual ....

[Macca]

I'm quite sure everyone who has lived with a Thai family, particularly this in rural areas, has a similar story or two to share.
The Thais are without doubt the master race and know far better than any farang in every situation.
As someone said on a post recently "I've yet to meet a Thai that doesn't know more than me".

Hope we can have an update of the in laws reaction when you're not forthcoming with the finances required to buy the new parts.

I'm currently being entertained by updates from a friend having a house built near Khanchanaburi.
Despite having spent over 40 years in the construction business, starting as a labourer and finishing as a site manager, and being a qualified electrician it appears no one will listen to his requests on how specific things should be done.

[pf-flyer]

I have been here only one year and I have a saying to remind myself. " You Learn "..
The first time we went to the PEA office to make preparations for the temp electric hook up to build out house. That was my initiation for me that I was going to be treated by some family members as inferior. My wife, Her sister and her sisters husband and our niece were with us. The four of them knew absolutely nothing about electricity. They were discussing among themselves that number 16 wire and 16 amps was the same thing. When we arrived at the PEA office I told my wife to ask if we can speak to one of the engineers to get recommendations for wire size requirements because we were not familiar with Thai standards. My request was considered unnecessary and was completely ignored by the family members. When were in the PEA office I was told to go and sit down and we will take care of everything.
After 26 years I retired as an IT manger in the Science College at a State University. My office was in the Physics Department. One of my responsibilities was to support the electrical and the electronics on a 2 Million Electron Volt Particle Beam Accelerator. I know a little bit about electricity.
This story ends when just my wife and I made the third visit to the PEA office and got to speak to an engineer. He made the recommendations and we purchased the proper size of wire that we needed. The same family members criticized that the wire we purchased was too large and we could use smaller diameter cheaper wire.

[redwolf]

Men sort things out among themselves here. If she's stuck translating then situations will just be mis-managed forever.

Become super-fluent in Thai as spoken in that province, and politely keep women off to the side when 'face' requires it.

Command a permanent leadership role within the first one thousand days.

[just an opinion]

RW

[Galee]

If you want frustration, build a house.

[parrot]

Men sort things out among themselves here. If she's stuck translating then situations will just be mis-managed forever.

Become super-fluent in Thai as spoken in that province, and politely keep women off to the side when 'face' requires it.

Command a permanent leadership role within the first one thousand days.

[just an opinion]

RW

I second that opinion. When our voltage dropped in the evenings to 160 volts, I knew we had a big problem. But everyone in the village said, 'that's the way it is'. Before I had any sort of handle on the Thai language, I spent a few hours constructing sentences using a dictionary and marched myself down to the electric office. In very bad Thai, I described the situation and the engineer agreed it was 'below standard'. It took a few months to get the problem corrected, but what the villagers had been living with for many many years was finally solved with the installation of a transformer along the lines.
It was then that I knew I had to buckle down and learn the language......or be dependent on someone else to do all the negotiating for me.
You can reason all you like with yourself that you're too old to learn the language or that you can't deal with a tonal language.......or you can learn the language....at least enough to get by. It's not easy, but it's not impossible....even for an old fart....with hearing aids.

[bumper]

That is a fact, so does being the local bank with no payback. Can't expect help from the wife unless your very lucky. Sometimes you just got to say no. A practice I'm working on.

Think about it why would they listen to us they get what they want anyway, in most cases.

I'm overdue for a basic Thai course again if AUA offers it again.

I pull the book out study a bit, then forget it again. That is my fault, not any Thai's

[faranginUTH]

I have been here only one year and I have a saying to remind myself. " You Learn "..

My wife, Her sister and her sisters husband and our niece were with us. The four of them knew absolutely nothing about electricity.

lesson learned is .......... you should of not dragged the family along, and just have your wife translate for you

if you can personally speak the language, they do not pull this "farang is stupid, Thai smarter" BS

[Firfox]

Yes we have to ensure that we do everything possible to ensure our Thai friends/family/employees and Tom Dick and Harry do not lose face. However, we need to use a little common sense. I had a school built two years ago in Udon and we employed Thai labour and a site manager (Thai) who was a friend of the family. There were many problems along the way. For example I told them not to wire up the lights or actually purchase any lights without me being there to purchase. Yes, you have guessed it I arrived one evening at the site to find fluorescent lights and tubes installed. This for me was the 'straw that broke the camels back'. I insisted that they took them out and returned them too the store. In the on-going discussion I explained that I was the one paying, it would be my school and they either do it my way or hit the highway. I was very polite and my wife was with her translation.

To cut a long story short I have used this team a few times now and they have come to realise that yes the Farang wants this doing his way but he pays well and give everything a good bonus at the end of the work if everything is satisfactory.

Yes, be polite and no its not our country but do not lose all sanity. Act like a grown man/women and use the education you have either trained for or gained through experience!

[semperfiguy]

Yes we have to ensure that we do everything possible to ensure our Thai friends/family/employees and Tom Dick and Harry do not lose face. However, we need to use a little common sense. I had a school built two years ago in Udon and we employed Thai labour and a site manager (Thai) who was a friend of the family. There were many problems along the way. For example I told them not to wire up the lights or actually purchase any lights without me being there to purchase. Yes, you have guessed it I arrived one evening at the site to find fluorescent lights and tubes installed. This for me was the 'straw that broke the camels back'. I insisted that they took them out and returned them too the store. In the on-going discussion I explained that I was the one paying, it would be my school and they either do it my way or hit the highway. I was very polite and my wife was with her translation.

To cut a long story short I have used this team a few times now and they have come to realise that yes the Farang wants this doing his way but he pays well and give everything a good bonus at the end of the work if everything is satisfactory.

Yes, be polite and no its not our country but do not lose all sanity. Act like a grown man/women and use the education you have either trained for or gained through experience!

Firfox....just curious to know if you ever got around to asking them WHY they did what they did. Of course it doesn't matter at this point, but my biggest problem with not speaking the language is just trying to figure out why the Thais do some of the strange things that they do. Many things just defy all logic and seem to be fairly typical from one Thai to another. I would give anything to have the kind of relationship with just one Thai, besides those in my own family, with whom I could sit down and just ask 100 questions about why Thais do some of the things that they do which we in the West just consider really bizarre.

[bumper]

Asking why would be pointless. They do because as a norm, we just take it. Saving face so far I have yet to meets a Thai that worries about that with me, If it's not mutual respect then it's no respect at all.

I respect people who treat me in the same way. If not I simply don't need them in my life, doesn't matter what country they come from. As to my wife sanding up for me Only seen it once in ten years. I was married to a Filipina for sixteen years. It was No different. Especially when it came to family. :-"

[urban legend]

Remember Thai people are human they are not that different in their customs to we are polite is polite , stupid is stupid, moral is moral ,rude is rude so on and so forth . I see many farang in Thailand dancing to their tunes going with the so called flow ...The problem is to choose if it's a conflicting act is of selfishness, stupidity .No person likes to lose face anywhere around the world and I personally think many expats in put to much emphasis on the "face subject" . I have been married for 13 years to a Thai and have always spoke my mind while trying to come to a compromise solution or hit common ground .My point is stand your ground if you generally think you are in the right and stick to your ground not dance around them with over polite wai's by all means be polite but not over the top ...

let the good times roll

[jackspratt]

Remember Thai people are human they are not that different in their customs to we are polite is polite , stupid is stupid, moral is moral ,rude is rude so on and so forth . I see many farang in Thailand dancing to their tunes going with the so called flow ...The problem is to choose if it's a conflicting act is of selfishness, stupidity .No person likes to lose face anywhere around the world and I personally think many expats in put to much emphasis on the "face subject" . I have been married for 13 years to a Thai and have always spoke my mind while trying to come to a compromise solution or hit common ground .My point is stand your ground if you generally think you are in the right and stick to your ground not dance around them with over polite wai's by all means be polite but not over the top ...

let the good times roll

Danny ........... someone has hijacked your (alternative) user name. PM the Mods immediately.

But seriously, your post has a lot of common sense. No scoff, no dribble ......... keep up the good work. =D>

[urban legend]

Remember Thai people are human they are not that different in their customs to we are polite is polite , stupid is stupid, moral is moral ,rude is rude so on and so forth . I see many farang in Thailand dancing to their tunes going with the so called flow ...The problem is to choose if it's a conflicting act is of selfishness, stupidity .No person likes to lose face anywhere around the world and I personally think many expats in put to much emphasis on the "face subject" . I have been married for 13 years to a Thai and have always spoke my mind while trying to come to a compromise solution or hit common ground .My point is stand your ground if you generally think you are in the right and stick to your ground not dance around them with over polite wai's by all means be polite but not over the top ...

let the good times roll

Danny ........... someone has hijacked your (alternative) user name. PM the Mods immediately.

But seriously, your post has a lot of common sense. No scoff, no dribble ......... keep up the good work. =D>

Cheers Jack happy new yeah all my posts have to be screened before they are processed can you imagine how choreographed strangled and restricted I feeling right now.. Bob and the mods are doing great job but my posts are restricted like taking the blood out of a horror film .......However let the good times roll

[bumper]

Good example today, we are cementing in the lower part of the small fish pond. The guy asked for 40K, didn't argue with him just told him I didn't have the money to do it for that price. He immediately dropped to 20K about the right price.

Would he have taken the 40 K you darn right he would of. But there was need to argue, if anyone lost face in that deal it was me. As I said I didn't have the money. My wife would have said yes to save face. In the end I got a fair deal.

[urban legend]

Good example today, we are cementing in the lower part of the small fish pond. The guy asked for 40K, didn't argue with him just told him I didn't have the money to do it for that price. He immediately dropped to 20K about the right price.

Would he have taken the 40 K you darn right he would of. But there was need to argue, if anyone lost face in that deal it was me. As I said I didn't have the money. My wife would have said yes to save face. In the end I got a fair deal.

A builder is a builder oddly enough I'm having work done on my humble abode at the moment and the builder I have elected to do the work was told to sharpen his pencil and have a rethink and came down to the price I wanted to pay . I have said in a before and I'll say it again expats of Thailand put to much to much emphasis on face ,at the end of the day if you paid BT 40,000 like in the west you would have lost face people saying "How much bumper what a mug"Thailand is a land mass on Planet Earth inhabited by humans they are not so different from "Mr farang" It's a 747 you land on at Bangkoks Suvarnabhumi airport not the Star Ship Enterprise ....


MONEY SAVING TIP FOR BUMPER =Expect to pay 300-400 bt for a builder per day for example 400 BT per day gets you 50 days labour for you agreed amount of 20,000BT.. I know you have to take materials into account but for the bottom of a fish pond this does seems a bit extreme ...(Hope this helps)

There is life Jim but not as we know it let the good times roll ...

[bumper]

That figure including digging the mud out and all materials so I'm OK with it.

[urban legend]

That figure including digging the mud out and all materials so I'm OK with it.

Fair enough Bumper if you are happy that's the main thing for me I'd want the Gorges Dam in China for that money :-"


NEVER worry about losing face losing money is far worst and let the good times roll

[bumper]

Did I mention it's not coy pond it''s a commercial fish pond smaller of the two I have, Soon to be home to 1,000 cat fish