ClimateGate busts things wide open

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jackspratt
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by jackspratt » August 20, 2019, 12:55 pm

We also have an abundance of sunshine, saint.

But while there has been a big increase in the use of solar, while you have troglodyte, conservative governments in power, being propped up by coalminers' money, things are going to improve only slowly.

:oops:



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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by saint » August 20, 2019, 1:42 pm

Slow improvement , is still some improvement i guess . Even China , one of your biggest importers of coal , is slowly waking up to smell the coffee !

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Barney » August 20, 2019, 1:55 pm

jackspratt wrote:
August 20, 2019, 12:55 pm
We also have an abundance of sunshine, saint.

But while there has been a big increase in the use of solar, while you have troglodyte, conservative governments in power, being propped up by coalminers' money, things are going to improve only slowly.

:oops:
C'mon Mr Spratt,
As much as I find some of your posts to be informative if not totally unbiased. Your apparent dislike of the Liberal Gov't is allowing you to throw out some false information in regard to the so called troglodyte, conservative governments achievements. There are actually many non coal related power projects on the design board and a number already financed and signed off by the Libs. Not saying the unpopular Labor team have not tried to help, but they do like to oppose for opposing sake sometimes. This includes the Snowy .2 project, just signed recently by your best mate ScoMo and the Libs. You may have already researched this project, but if you haven't then here is a small fact sheet on the project. Some may find educational.
This is a 4 billion dollar plus project. it takes time to finance something that big. Massive in the scale of how much STORED energy we can achieve. You will see one map showing Wind and Solar areas that will feed back into this storage capability.
Fixing any perceived climate change problem has to be financed correctly, Labor don't care to much about who eventually pays, and baby steps need to be taken. Australia is trying to make a change, so don't mislead people.
I wouldn't worry to much, over time Australia will achieve a sufficient reduction of our carbon footprint, unlike the other big nations who are not achieving based in part on their overpopulated status. People dont talk to much about reducing carbon by reducing birth rates, strange that. There's money in people. Just ask any crazy economist who thinks we need more people. High population IMO is a far greater immediate problem.

https://www.snowyhydro.com.au/our-scheme/snowy20/

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by jackspratt » August 20, 2019, 2:53 pm

Which part of what I said is "false information" Barney?

Australia produces about 15% of it electricity from renewables - way behind even the UK at 36%, and even China at 25%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... le_sources

The Snowy Scheme as it exists contributes about 2% of Australia's total electricity generation. Snowy 2, while most welcome, will increase that to about 3% as it comes onstream from about 2025.

In the meantime, the government(s) are trying to keep open dirty, old coal-powered power stations when even the private owners want to shut them, because they are a dead dog.

They are pushing for the opening of new coal mining projects - when big companies like BHP and Rio are divesting; banks won't finance them; and insurance companies won't insure them.

And instead of setting a carbon price (which most experts agree is critical), they try to wiggle out of international commitments (Kyoto), and throw money at the flawed Emissions Reduction Fund, which gives millions to big polluters if they promise to reduce their pollution (instead of making them pay). :shock:

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Barney » August 20, 2019, 3:56 pm

jackspratt wrote:
August 20, 2019, 2:53 pm
Which part of what I said is "false information" Barney?

Australia produces about 15% of it electricity from renewables - way behind even the UK at 36%, and even China at 25%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... le_sources

The Snowy Scheme as it exists contributes about 2% of Australia's total electricity generation. Snowy 2, while most welcome, will increase that to about 3% as it comes onstream from about 2025.

In the meantime, the government(s) are trying to keep open dirty, old coal-powered power stations when even the private owners want to shut them, because they are a dead dog.

They are pushing for the opening of new coal mining projects - when big companies like BHP and Rio are divesting; banks won't finance them; and insurance companies won't insure them.

And instead of setting a carbon price (which most experts agree is critical), they try to wiggle out of international commitments (Kyoto), and throw money at the flawed Emissions Reduction Fund, which gives millions to big polluters if they promise to reduce their pollution (instead of making them pay). :shock:
Your statement that the libs are being propped up, Is the misleading statement.
If Labor had won the election then they to would have been propped up. Australia are not in a position at this point in time to shut down our coal fed power stations, that is a fact. Go ahead shut them down tomorrow and where will the power come from? As I said it takes time and a lot of finances to be fully renewable, and it wont be in my lifetime. Australia is shutting down coal fed power plants. It will be gradual and is happening. I agree they Australia need to shut them down, but people must be realists on when it can happen. 2050 maybe. Weare not building new units and our plants are very old and their electrical life is closing.
Believe what you want with statistics on who overseas is trying to reduce their carbon footprint. Yes others are pushing big on renewables making their percentage comparisons look good, but they are still building new coal plants. That's fact. If you believe china is telling the truth then good for you, its BS. They are building power stations, India is another, they are building coal fed units, they to are full of BS.
Now with the 2nd part of coal is our export and other countries want to buy our coal then there is your focus point on who is really trying to reduce, not Australia. Labor supporters also conveniently forget in their budgets just how many people are involved in the coal industry, throw em on the scrap heap tomorrow and see how much the left wing unions scream. They will blame anyone except labor.
You may need to read online construction magazines showing future projects that will be built to get a better idea whose doing what to provide power.
I still stand by my statement that over population will destroy society. That would be my root cause focus for the expanding of carbon production. In the mean time both those countries, india and China are building or about to consider building nuclear power plants. The USA and Britain are at this moment building nuclear plants on home soil to come online soon. So please when you talk of Britain being a great example of renewables you must talk apples for apples. If Australia build nuclear power plants then you are on the same page. I think you may be on the side of no nuclear in Australia, is that the case? if so then don't sprout how others are being planet earth responsible above Australia.
Gas is the flavor of the month and we are or about to be the biggest exporter of LNG in the world. But we buy it back from others? WTF.
We are about to construct and extract from 2 lithium mines with huge deposits in WA, I'll bet we don't make the batteries in Aussie? We will by them back from Tesla at a big markup in our cars.
Kyoto and all the other meetings are just talk fests so they feel good. Countries need to be accountable for their own reductions, not be held to some pie in the sky protocol, they just send the spin doctors to the meetings. That's all we do these days is all talk and no action.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by FrazeeDK » August 20, 2019, 4:41 pm

China may be building a larger "renewable" power capability but they're building lots of nuke power plants too. https://www.world-nuclear.org/informati ... power.aspx

Judging from the massive improvement in Beijing's Air Quality Index they're doing something right.... Yes, 151 is high but AQI's in excess of 500 were not unusual a while back. https://www.airvisual.com/china/beijing ... in-beijing
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by noosard » August 20, 2019, 6:06 pm

China burnt 1% more coal in 2018
Does not sound like much of a cut back

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 15, 2019, 6:20 pm

.

A mmcc Believer comes clean and confirms what we already knew.

Ansel Elgort, an actor and climate activist, admitted to HuffPo that the Left “over-exaggerates” their issues. The alarmism is part of the plan, but he says that it backfires on them and has been counterproductive.

Elgort believes that because "the Left overexaggerates," it will always be difficult to reach any compromise on mmcc issues. They get caught LYING all the time and fudging data.

Elgort:
"The problem is that the left over-exaggerates and the right can feel that over-exaggeration, so then they shun whatever scientific proof there is.”
Translated: The Left has so much bullshit with them, that no one knows what to believe, so they just discount all of it as bullshit.

Elgort may be one of the only Leftists willing to admit that their tactics are harming their movement. But then, Elgort wouldn't be a true Leftist if he's unwilling to lie and be a hypocrite.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Udon Map » September 16, 2019, 3:54 pm

Lone Star wrote:
September 15, 2019, 6:20 pm
Ansel Elgort, an actor and climate activist, admitted to HuffPo that the Left “over-exaggerates” their issues.
"Admitted"? in order to know whether reported data is exaggerated (let alone "over-exaggerate"d), one would have to know what the data is, no? Don't know about you, but I'm not going to rely on a 25 year old actor and DJ who hasn't attended, let alone graduated, from college for an assessment of scientific data. On what alleged facts has he based his assessment that climate change is "over-exaggerate"d by those who believe that it's a problem??

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Doodoo » September 16, 2019, 4:45 pm

Lone Star wrote: ↑September 15, 2019, 6:20 pm
Ansel Elgort, an actor and climate activist, admitted to HuffPo that the Left “over-exaggerates” their issues.
"Admitted"? in order to know whether reported data is exaggerated (let alone "over-exaggerate"d), one would have to know what the data is, no? Don't know about you, but I'm not going to rely on a 25 year old actor and DJ who hasn't attended, let alone graduated, from college for an assessment of scientific data. On what alleged facts has he based his assessment that climate change is "over-exaggerate"d by those who believe that it's a problem??

GET ANSEL!!!

Overexaggerate certainly he does but he isnt surrounded by experts, scientists, colleges, people who know what they are there for.
Who else comes to mind regarding exaggeration??? Windmills /light bulbs cause cancer, we shoot one of their drone, I will show you!!, We send Japan nothing, by comparison, nothing.” The United States exported $62 billion worth of goods to Japan last year.
I will leave it up to you to come up with a name

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 16, 2019, 7:10 pm

Udon Map wrote:
September 16, 2019, 3:54 pm
Lone Star wrote:
September 15, 2019, 6:20 pm
Ansel Elgort, an actor and climate activist, admitted to HuffPo that the Left “over-exaggerates” their issues.
"Admitted"? in order to know whether reported data is exaggerated (let alone "over-exaggerate"d), one would have to know what the data is, no? Don't know about you, but I'm not going to rely on a 25 year old actor and DJ who hasn't attended, let alone graduated, from college for an assessment of scientific data. On what alleged facts has he based his assessment that climate change is "over-exaggerate"d by those who believe that it's a problem??
It's factually accurate that believers have been caught fudging data. I'm not relying on Mr. Elgort for that information. I've read about it for myself. It seems like it happens once or twice a year.

I was shocked that a believer would publicly admit that their alarmist tactics are backfiring. Because they ARE backfiring. And then HuffPo publishes it! Amazing times.

Enough time has passed for the Angry Poodle's predictions to have come and gone without any of his catastrophic predictions coming true. That hasn't helped believers in their quest.

By the way, Greta says we're all gonna die in 11 years.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Udon Map » September 16, 2019, 7:28 pm

Lone Star wrote:
September 16, 2019, 7:10 pm
Udon Map wrote:
September 16, 2019, 3:54 pm
Lone Star wrote:
September 15, 2019, 6:20 pm
Ansel Elgort, an actor and climate activist, admitted to HuffPo that the Left “over-exaggerates” their issues.
"Admitted"? in order to know whether reported data is exaggerated (let alone "over-exaggerate"d), one would have to know what the data is, no? Don't know about you, but I'm not going to rely on a 25 year old actor and DJ who hasn't attended, let alone graduated, from college for an assessment of scientific data. On what alleged facts has he based his assessment that climate change is "over-exaggerate"d by those who believe that it's a problem??
It's factually accurate that believers have been caught fudging data. I'm not relying on Mr. Elgort for that information. I've read about it for myself. It seems like it happens once or twice a year.
While I agree with what you say, it's also important to note that the fact that many people who believe that climate change is a problem have been caught lying/exaggerating, doesn't mean that it's not a problem.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 16, 2019, 7:45 pm

Udon Map wrote:
September 16, 2019, 7:28 pm
While I agree with what you say, it's also important to note that the fact that many people who believe that climate change is a problem have been caught lying/exaggerating, doesn't mean that it's not a problem.
I have always acknowledged that climate change exists.

My criticisms of the mmcc movement are throughout this thread and have not changed.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by pipoz4444 » September 16, 2019, 7:59 pm

jackspratt wrote:
August 20, 2019, 2:53 pm
Which part of what I said is "false information" Barney?

Australia produces about 15% of it electricity from renewables - way behind even the UK at 36%, and even China at 25%.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... le_sources

The Snowy Scheme as it exists contributes about 2% of Australia's total electricity generation. Snowy 2, while most welcome, will increase that to about 3% as it comes onstream from about 2025.

In the meantime, the government(s) are trying to keep open dirty, old coal-powered power stations when even the private owners want to shut them, because they are a dead dog.

They are pushing for the opening of new coal mining projects - when big companies like BHP and Rio are divesting; banks won't finance them; and insurance companies won't insure them.

And instead of setting a carbon price (which most experts agree is critical), they try to wiggle out of international commitments (Kyoto), and throw money at the flawed Emissions Reduction Fund, which gives millions to big polluters if they promise to reduce their pollution (instead of making them pay). :shock:
It also about relevance and or significance, in the World of CO2 polution and poluters, and who really contributes what from where.

Australia is a relatively insignificant contributer by volume of Total World CO2 emissions (m3), compared to other world players, such a China, USA, India, Russia, Japan, and yes Germany, South Korea, Canada, Iran and Saudi (yes most of the elite G8 group). Wikipedia ranked Australia as No. 16 in the world, by total CO2 emission, in 2017 and UK No 18. You look up the Link.

Combine the Total emissions of the Worlds No's 1to 10 offender, and Australia's Total is no more than a pimple on your arse. One might argue that it is high per capita, but at 1.3%, it is still a pimple.

Australia does not have over 1.3 Billion people waking up every morning farting with their buffalo's, most of whom walk across the road and happly pooh in the nearest paddock because the country a a whole, does not have and people wont use, Toilets, a culture of and people most of whom openly burn their rubbish & waste because their Goverments will not build treatment plants and or organize to proerly collect & dispose of it etc.

Start with the cultural aspects of some of these major contribution countries and their peoples/population, who by their nature and livig habits are the root cause of muh of their own carbon emissions, then you might make a diiference. [-X [-X . I am referring to several G7 so called World Leading Developed Countries :-k :-k [-(

As to the relevance and volume contribution of Australia's, 24 number or so, coal powered Power Stations to our massive 1.30 % of Total World CO2 emissions, I will leave that to the expers to research. I suggest they (the 24) contibute less than 0.09% each on a bad day. =; =; How many does China build each year :-k

If serious about dealing with the reducion of Total World CO2 emissions, then start with addressing the major root causes and not the fringe issues/contruters. :-&

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by GT93 » September 17, 2019, 1:59 pm

So let Australia do business as usual? Other countries aren't going to like that. I think Australia should be leaping at the opportunity to become a world leader in new technologies such as solar energy. There will be more jobs in those industries than in coal.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Barney » September 17, 2019, 4:26 pm

GT93 wrote:
September 17, 2019, 1:59 pm
So let Australia do business as usual? Other countries aren't going to like that. I think Australia should be leaping at the opportunity to become a world leader in new technologies such as solar energy. There will be more jobs in those industries than in coal.
When are you going to stop trolling about Australia. You just continually regurgitate your shyte with no facts or details.

You are just the type of neighbor Australia does not want, but, the vast majority NZer's are very appreciative of what the good hearted aussie has provide NZ over the years. You are not in that majority.

You come from a country that fits into Australia about 30 times, have no real industry requiring large amounts of power and at present can throw up a few wind farms and rely on your hydro plants to then tell the world what a good global citizen NZ is. Solar not so good though I imagine since you are known as the land of the long white cloud.

Australia is rapidly moving to renewables, no matter what you and your forever critical mates expound to the world, with roof top panels increasing about 50% each year, large solar and wind farm projects on the go and more on the drawing board. As mentioned previously a new project worth 4 billion dollars of fully renewable and self sustaining Snowy Mountains 2 hydro electric scheme now going ahead. Water will be used pumping from one existing hydro storage lake to another through underground turbines. Some detractors vomiting BS of Australia do not have a clue what's been on the design board for some time and now being executed.
Unlike NZ we cannot just shut our coal powered stations over night, ( did NZ close its last coal fired power plant in 2018 like promised?) as we do use a lot of power and currently available renewable technology wont make the grade just yet.
Some forget it all costs money, and lots of it, for the large projects Australia require to be fully renewable and without exporting our mining wealth and gas it just wont happen. Private money is required for this and takes time to finance.The lefty labor gov't was going to borrow , borrow, borrow to meet their election promises.
Our land mass is almost the same as the 48 states of the USA and with only 25 odd million people who will pay. Perhaps we should just shut down, send all non aussie citizens home and stop buying you few ships of produce. Massive saving for us on social security payments to.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by GT93 » September 20, 2019, 2:29 am

I don't know what you're going on about their Barney. I'm an Aussiephile. It's one of the best countries in the world on many measures.

The picture you're painting isn't what comes across in the Aussie media. I also wouldn't hold NZ up as being a particularly good international citizen on efforts to mitigate climate change.

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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by yartims » September 20, 2019, 2:34 pm

read the latest book on the subject and its not good news ................UNINHABITABLE EARTH

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2019/ ... lace-wells

we aint got long either and it cant be changed ..too late
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Lone Star » September 21, 2019, 1:51 pm

.

Despite the predictions and encouragement of St. Greta of Thunburg, and the alarmism of the mmcc believers (lower case intended, since they are losing credibility with each passing day), there are over 40 predictions made by these folks that have NOT come true.

Over 50 years of failed predictions ...

https://cei.org/blog/wrong-again-50-yea ... redictions

If you knew anyone whose advice was wrong as few as 3 times, you'd probably stop listening to them, but the mmcc believers ignore their defeats and march onward in the name of science, while ignoring reality.

Here are some of the absolute best, but failed, alarmism attempts in chronological order:

1966 - Oil Gone in Ten Years
1969 - Everyone Will Disappear In a Cloud Of Blue Steam By 1989
1970 - Killer Bees (SNL even laughed at this one)
1970 - Ice Age By 2000
1970 - Urban Citizens Will Require Gas Masks by 1985
1970 - America Subject to Water Rationing By 1974 and Food Rationing By 1980
1971 - New Ice Age Coming By 2020 or 2030
1972 - Oil Depleted in 20 Years
1976 - Scientific Consensus Planet Cooling, Famines imminent
1980 - Peak Oil In 2000s
1978 - No End in Sight to 30-Year Cooling Trend
1988 - Temperatures in DC Will Hit Record Highs (that's weather, right?)
1988 - Maldive Islands will Be Underwater by 2018 (didn't happen)
1989 - Rising Sea Levels will Obliterate Nations if Nothing Done by 2000
1989 - New York City’s West Side Highway Underwater by 2019 (didn't happen)
1996 - Peak Oil in 2020
2002 - Famine In 10 Years If We Don’t Give Up Eating Fish, Meat, and Dairy
2002 - Peak Oil in 2010
2004 - Britain will Be Siberia by 2024
2005 - Manhattan Underwater by 2015
2008 - Arctic will Be Ice Free by 2018
2008 - Climate Genius "the Angry Poodle" Predicts Ice-Free Arctic by 2013
2009 - Prince Charles Says we Have 96 Months to Save World
2009 - UK Prime Minister Says 50 Days to ‘Save The Planet From Catastrophe’
2009 - Climate Genius "the Angry Poodle" Moves 2013 Prediction of Ice-Free Arctic to 2014
2013 - Arctic Ice-Free by 2015

How many of their alarmist predictions HAVE come true?

It's time for the world's population to keep doing all they can to recycle and be aware of bad habits, but to go for the gusto and enjoy their lives. Like Obama. All of his mmcc hysteria didn't prevent him from spending $15 million on waterfront property. Bayrack totally ignored his own bullshit and chose to invest on the oceanfront -- and the bank financed it! Must not be so huge of a risk after all.
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Re: ClimateGate busts things wide open

Post by Udon Map » September 21, 2019, 9:25 pm

Lone Star wrote:
September 21, 2019, 1:51 pm
Over 50 years of failed predictions ...
Mexico will pay for the wall.

Just sayin'....

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