Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

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semperfiguy
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by semperfiguy » November 9, 2019, 6:35 pm

RLTrader wrote:
November 9, 2019, 2:58 pm
Got this yesterday.

Message for U.S. Citizen: New Health Insurance Requirement for Long-Stay Visa Applicants (November 8, 2019)

Screen Shot 2019-11-09 at 14.54.34.png

You'd think the US Embassy could get their information correct if their going to send a notice out to all citizens; otherwise, they only fuel the fire of confusion over this issue. The mandatory insurance requirement is only for new O-A and O-X Visas based on RETIREMENT issued after October 31st outside of Thailand and those who are currently on extensions of stay based on RETIREMENT whose current extension originated from a Non-Immigrant O-A who will be required to show proof of insurance at the next extension renewal.


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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by fantom » November 9, 2019, 6:36 pm

Having digested sometimewoodworker's excellent explanation (thanks!), I now suspect that the lady I spoke to was not suggesting I apply for an O visa, but suggesting that my next annual extension of stay could be based on marriage to a Thai, even though previous extensions were based on retirement. I intend to take jackspratt's advice and seek clarification at my next 90 day report. Tom

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by FrazeeDK » November 9, 2019, 6:48 pm

Semper Fi Guy.. Yes and the ACS advisory also states, "U.S. citizens can present proof of existing insurance (U.S.-based or otherwise) that covers them in Thailand or they can purchase an insurance policy via the Thai General Insurance Association’s website at http://longstay.tgia.org.
U.S. citizens will need to download the Overseas Insurance Certificate and have it completed, signed, and stamped by their insurance company if using a non-Thai insurance policy to qualify."

Now, I'm retired U.S. military on Tricare for Life. I can download the stock Tricare letter saying I'm covered, but it doesn't provide the detail shown on the Immigration required "Overseas Insurance Certificate." I don't place much hope in Tricare filling out and stamping that form but I've sent an e-mail to the Tricare office in Singapore attaching both my Tricare Eligibility Letter and a copy of the Thai government mandated Overseas Insurance Certificate... Let's see what they say... Worth a shot ...
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 9, 2019, 7:26 pm

semperfiguy wrote:
November 9, 2019, 6:35 pm
RLTrader wrote:
November 9, 2019, 2:58 pm
Got this yesterday.

Message for U.S. Citizen: New Health Insurance Requirement for Long-Stay Visa Applicants (November 8, 2019)

Screen Shot 2019-11-09 at 14.54.34.png

You'd think the US Embassy could get their information correct if their going to send a notice out to all citizens; otherwise, they only fuel the fire of confusion over this issue. The mandatory insurance requirement is only for new O-A and O-X Visas based on RETIREMENT issued after October 31st outside of Thailand and those who are currently on extensions of stay based on RETIREMENT whose current extension originated from a Non-Immigrant O-A who will be required to show proof of insurance at the next extension renewal.
Regrettably while that may have been the intention and it may be true for Udon immigration it is not true for other immigration offices. Here is an ambiguous notice from Chang Mai that could certainly be read as applying to all extensions from an OA/OX Visa.
6F8B606F-2272-4FC4-ACEC-3C74D736EA1C.png
There are certainly offices whose information given to those asking is that everyone extending from an OA/OX Visa however long ago that was given and for whatever reason, including marriage, must have insurance.

So while many readers here may use the Udon immigration office not all do
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by Tango Sierra » November 9, 2019, 7:41 pm

The notice the Embassy sent out is just more confusion as it only states the requirement for a visa applicants, does not state the requirements for an Extension to Stay (EOS). As most of use already have a Visa and will be requesting a EOS, the Embassy should have stated these requirements. Police Order 548/2562 states clearly that we must buy Thai health insurance online and gives the web site. As we know what Imm Office say today may not mean anything next week. Best bet is to comply with the Police Order.

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by Stantheman » November 9, 2019, 7:48 pm

FrazeeDK wrote:
November 9, 2019, 6:48 pm
Semper Fi Guy.. Yes and the ACS advisory also states, "U.S. citizens can present proof of existing insurance (U.S.-based or otherwise) that covers them in Thailand or they can purchase an insurance policy via the Thai General Insurance Association’s website at http://longstay.tgia.org.
U.S. citizens will need to download the Overseas Insurance Certificate and have it completed, signed, and stamped by their insurance company if using a non-Thai insurance policy to qualify."

Now, I'm retired U.S. military on Tricare for Life. I can download the stock Tricare letter saying I'm covered, but it doesn't provide the detail shown on the Immigration required "Overseas Insurance Certificate." I don't place much hope in Tricare filling out and stamping that form but I've sent an e-mail to the Tricare office in Singapore attaching both my Tricare Eligibility Letter and a copy of the Thai government mandated Overseas Insurance Certificate... Let's see what they say... Worth a shot ...
Dought Thai immigration will accept Tricare. 1st for out of network ioverseas it is a reimbursement, not a pay hospital direct insurance. 2nd Tricare doesn't show how much they cover so where will immigration see the 400,000 baht minimum.

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by semperfiguy » November 10, 2019, 10:22 am

sometimewoodworker wrote:
November 9, 2019, 7:26 pm
semperfiguy wrote:
November 9, 2019, 6:35 pm
RLTrader wrote:
November 9, 2019, 2:58 pm
Got this yesterday.

Message for U.S. Citizen: New Health Insurance Requirement for Long-Stay Visa Applicants (November 8, 2019)

Screen Shot 2019-11-09 at 14.54.34.png

You'd think the US Embassy could get their information correct if their going to send a notice out to all citizens; otherwise, they only fuel the fire of confusion over this issue. The mandatory insurance requirement is only for new O-A and O-X Visas based on RETIREMENT issued after October 31st outside of Thailand and those who are currently on extensions of stay based on RETIREMENT whose current extension originated from a Non-Immigrant O-A who will be required to show proof of insurance at the next extension renewal.
Regrettably while that may have been the intention and it may be true for Udon immigration it is not true for other immigration offices. Here is an ambiguous notice from Chang Mai that could certainly be read as applying to all extensions from an OA/OX Visa.
6F8B606F-2272-4FC4-ACEC-3C74D736EA1C.png
There are certainly offices whose information given to those asking is that everyone extending from an OA/OX Visa however long ago that was given and for whatever reason, including marriage, must have insurance.

So while many readers here may use the Udon immigration office not all do

With all due respect I think the memo from Chiang Mai Immigration referring to "including spouse and children" is NOT referring to extensions for reason of marriage or Category 2.19 In the case of being a family member of a Thai resident (applicable only to parents, spouse, children, adopted children, or spouse’s children), but instead this is referring to spouse and children who are accompanying THE APPLICANT of the O-A Visa. I know several Americans who have brought their wife and children here with them with an O-A for the reason of retirement and they too may now be required to carry insurance for reason of extension based on retirement. As always these notices are extremely vague and can be interpreting in more than one way, perhaps purposefully to allow discretion for the Immigration Director in any office, but the final litmus test will be to hear back from those who have personally experienced the application of these rules per the notice.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by parrot » November 10, 2019, 11:39 am

There are more pages of threads on this subject (UM/TV) than there are closed-door-testimony transcript pages on Trump. At least the transcript pages give some clarity.
There's this post on TV today..... https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/113325 ... t-14751929
That should give everyone some reason to pause and take a deep breath. If you're extending your stay or entering the country in the next month, then you probably have reason to be a bit worried. If you're doing so after the new year, I'd let things shake out and see what happens.

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by pf-flyer » November 10, 2019, 1:01 pm

I promised myself that I was not going to do anymore posting on this thread but I changed my mind and I decided to share with you what took place when my wife and I visited our local immigration office on THURSDAY 7 NOV 2019 at 1:15 PM.
My Thai wife of 46 years and I arrived by air in Thailand on 12 AUG 2012. Both of us went through immigration at the airport with a U.S. Passport with a Non-immigration O-A visa. We have been doing extensions based on retirement since then. All of my current extension stamps have a Red Retirement stamp at the top. My wife's extension stamps in her U.S. Passport have a red stamp at the top that says Thai Citizen in Thai.
***************************************************************************************
The lady that usually takes care of extensions motioned for us to sit down in the chairs in front of her desk. We showed her our passports and she took a moment to look them over. We asked her if I would be able to change my current reason for the extension of retirement to the reason of extension to marriage and would we be required to purchase the mandatory health insurance. She said that I can do my next extension based on marriage and she gave me the checklist listed below for the paperwork to submit for my next extension based on marriage. I asked would then I be required to have the mandatory health insurance. She said no and my wife even though she entered Thailand on a U.S. passport would not be required to purchase health insurance because she is a Thai Citizen. Her extensions are granted because she is a Thai citizen. The lady at immigration told my wife there is no problem for her to stay on her U.S. passport and just to keep applying for extensions thy way she has been doing. I asked the lady at immigration would I be able to apply for an extension based on marriage now and she said yes you can however my extension is not due until August 2020 and you would lose all of that time. She recommended that I bring in the extension paperwork in July 2020. She reassured me several times that I could do all of this at our local immigration office. And I would not be required to have mandatory health insurance.
My biggest problem was I kept linking the extensions to the visas we used to enter Thailand. I realize now that I am here because I have received extensions to stay based on retirement and my next extension will be based on marriage. The lady at immigration kept pointing to my extension. She never pointed to or referred to the visa that I entered Thailand on. I agree with Parrot. I believe that things will be sorted out as time goes on.

[attachment=0]Extention Based on Marriage Checklist.pdf[/attachment][attachment=0]Extention Based on Marriage Checklist.pdf[/attachment]
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by the-monk » November 10, 2019, 1:16 pm

Good day, thanks for sharing. Greatly appreciated. If i understand you correctly you were NOT required to get medical insurance before your next renewal, Aug 2020... I was a bit concerned because i have a foreign trip next week and one more in March 2020, my next renewal is in October 2020. Thanks again. Keep posting new twists... Have a pleasant safe Sunday.

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 10, 2019, 1:28 pm

pf-flyer wrote:
November 10, 2019, 1:01 pm


My biggest problem was I kept linking the extensions to the visas we used to enter Thailand.
That is probably because form TM47 (extension of stay request) requires you to list the visa you used to enter Thailand. So it is linked.

FWIW. the leaflet you were given hasn’t been updated since 2008 and doesn’t make clear that a bank letter and bank issued statement is required.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 10, 2019, 1:35 pm

the-monk wrote:
November 10, 2019, 1:16 pm
Good day, thanks for sharing. Greatly appreciated. If i understand you correctly you were NOT required to get medical insurance before your next renewal, Aug 2020... I was a bit concerned because i have a foreign trip next week and one more in March 2020, my next renewal is in October 2020. Thanks again. Keep posting new twists... Have a pleasant safe Sunday.
Currently, reporting is that nobody who is entering thailand on a reentry permit is being asked/required to have insurance.

It is (all) current OA Visa holders only

EDIT not all current OA Visa holders only visas issued from November 1 are being required to show insurance
Last edited by sometimewoodworker on November 13, 2019, 8:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by Bandung_Dero » November 10, 2019, 1:45 pm

@ pf-flyer
My Thai wife of 46 years and I arrived by air in Thailand on 12 AUG 2012. Both of us went through immigration at the airport with a U.S. Passport with a Non-immigration O-A visa.
Can I ask you if your TW still has a Thai Passport? If so why didn't she enter the Kingdom on that? Obviously, at 46, she would not have an 'OA' visa in her American Passport as the 50 yo rule applies.

P.S. I know we keep flogging this dead horse (as well as the TM30 thingy) but could not help but ask.

EDIT: I have read and reread this post and have a doubt. Is your wife 46 yo or have you been married 46 years? My question still applies about her having a Thai Passport in 2012.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by pf-flyer » November 10, 2019, 1:59 pm

[quote=Bandung_Dero post_id=558112 time=1573368346 user_id=49]
@ pf-flyer

[quote]My Thai wife of 46 years and I arrived by air in Thailand on 12 AUG 2012. Both of us went through immigration at the airport with a U.S. Passport with a Non-immigration O-A visa.[/quote]

Can I ask you if your TW still has a Thai Passport? If so why didn't she enter the Kingdom on that? Obviously, at 46, she would not have an 'OA' visa in her American Passport as the 50 yo rule applies.

P.S. I know we keep flogging this dead horse (as well as the TM30 thingy) but could not help but ask.
[/quote]

I should have indicated we have been married for 46 years and we lived in the U.S. for 40 years and my wife let her Thai passport expire after she got her U.S. citizenship. We were married in 1973 at Nong Han when I was stationed here at the RTAFB base. What used to be the main gate is still there.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by RLTrader » November 10, 2019, 3:20 pm

Well I guess, as it looks, I poured gasoline on the topic by posting the US Embassy notice? Thought it had some useful links?

What’s the Big stink about? Hell all you rich foreigners (being nice) just need to fork out another 100K for insurance (well, if your young enough to get some), so 900K per year, No Big Deal to you big spenders, one would think? Is not that part of the trickle-down effect? Most are hoping this will get rid of the riff-raft, but that’s what I think ya’al will be left with, just saying.
I believe that things will be sorted out as time goes on.


Me too, but you just might not like the solution, as in All Extensions will Require Health Insurance, seems to be the only fair solution, one would think, but TIT.

Good Luck to All

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by retired » November 10, 2019, 10:11 pm

pf-flyer wrote:
November 10, 2019, 1:01 pm
The lady that usually takes care of extensions motioned for us to sit down in the chairs in front of her desk. We showed her our passports and she took a moment to look them over. We asked her if I would be able to change my current reason for the extension of retirement to the reason of extension to marriage and would we be required to purchase the mandatory health insurance. She said that I can do my next extension based on marriage and she gave me the checklist listed below for the paperwork to submit for my next extension based on marriage. I asked would then I be required to have the mandatory health insurance. She said no and my wife even though she entered Thailand on a U.S. passport would not be required to purchase health insurance because she is a Thai Citizen. Her extensions are granted because she is a Thai citizen. The lady at immigration told my wife there is no problem for her to stay on her U.S. passport and just to keep applying for extensions thy way she has been doing. I asked the lady at immigration would I be able to apply for an extension based on marriage now and she said yes you can however my extension is not due until August 2020 and you would lose all of that time. She recommended that I bring in the extension paperwork in July 2020. She reassured me several times that I could do all of this at our local immigration office. And I would not be required to have mandatory health insurance.
My biggest problem was I kept linking the extensions to the visas we used to enter Thailand. I realize now that I am here because I have received extensions to stay based on retirement and my next extension will be based on marriage. The lady at immigration kept pointing to my extension. She never pointed to or referred to the visa that I entered Thailand on. I agree with Parrot. I believe that things will be sorted out as time goes on.

Forgive my confusion...Are you saying that Udon Immigration has said despite your original Visa being an OA, when you apply for your next extension - to apply for an extension on marriage instead of an extension for retirement (which you applied for in the past) and - No Insurance would be required?

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by pf-flyer » November 11, 2019, 5:29 am

[quote=retired post_id=558138 time=1573398711 user_id=34749]
[quote=pf-flyer post_id=558107 time=1573365687 user_id=4566]
The lady that usually takes care of extensions motioned for us to sit down in the chairs in front of her desk. We showed her our passports and she took a moment to look them over. We asked her if I would be able to change my current reason for the extension of retirement to the reason of extension to marriage and would we be required to purchase the mandatory health insurance. She said that I can do my next extension based on marriage and she gave me the checklist listed below for the paperwork to submit for my next extension based on marriage. I asked would then I be required to have the mandatory health insurance. She said no and my wife even though she entered Thailand on a U.S. passport would not be required to purchase health insurance because she is a Thai Citizen. Her extensions are granted because she is a Thai citizen. The lady at immigration told my wife there is no problem for her to stay on her U.S. passport and just to keep applying for extensions thy way she has been doing. I asked the lady at immigration would I be able to apply for an extension based on marriage now and she said yes you can however my extension is not due until August 2020 and you would lose all of that time. She recommended that I bring in the extension paperwork in July 2020. She reassured me several times that I could do all of this at our local immigration office. And I would not be required to have mandatory health insurance.
My biggest problem was I kept linking the extensions to the visas we used to enter Thailand. I realize now that I am here because I have received extensions to stay based on retirement and my next extension will be based on marriage. The lady at immigration kept pointing to my extension. She never pointed to or referred to the visa that I entered Thailand on. I agree with Parrot. I believe that things will be sorted out as time goes on.

[b]Forgive my confusion...Are you saying that Udon Immigration has said despite your original Visa being an OA, when you apply for your next extension - to apply for an extension on marriage instead of an extension for retirement (which you applied for in the past) and - No Insurance would be required?[/b]
[/quote]
YES..... My extension is what is permitting me to stay in Thailand. The Non-Immigrant O-A visa allowed me to enter Thailand for the first initial year. I am permitted to stay in Thailand after the first year because I applied and received an extension for each additional year after the first year, I am permitted to stay here now because I have an extension. My current extetnion is based on retirement. The lady at immigration told me that I can apply for an extension based on marriage when I submit an application for an extension based on marriage in July 2020 when my next extension is due. I asked her do I need to worry about being required to buy mandatory health insurance. She said no. She reassured me several times. If you have been renewing your extensions based on retirement and you have a Thai wife, then you have the option to apply for an extension based on marriage when you apply for your next extension. She told me and my wife that it is the individuals that are here on an O-A visa and do not have a Thai wife that " do not " have the option to apply for an extension based on marriage and they will need to purchase the insurance or leave before the end of their extension.
Take a look at your current extension it states you have an " extension of stay ". The lady at immigration kept pointing to my current extension of stay the entire time she was talking to us. She showed us an extension of stay paperwork based on a marriage that she just finished processing so that we would have an understanding of what the application requirements were. I included a copy of the checklist that she gave us in a previous posting.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by pf-flyer » November 11, 2019, 6:29 am

I joined Udonmap back in 2007. I was still working and living in the U.S. I remember one of the expatriates that has been living here for a long time gave me some advice that I never forgot and that was he told me to always have a Plan-B in place just in case. There are no guarantees in life. I have decided not to worry anymore about issues that I have no control over but to live and deal with issues one day at a time because things can change overnight and if things do change my wife and I have decided to deal with it as it comes.
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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by Kenr6583 » November 11, 2019, 7:01 am

I just read on several websites that the only two visas that are required to have Thai health insurance are the O-A and the O-X visas.

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Re: Mandatory health insurance for Non O-A visa effective from 31 October

Post by sometimewoodworker » November 12, 2019, 8:30 am

Kenr6583 wrote:
November 11, 2019, 7:01 am
I just read on several websites that the only two visas that are required to have Thai health insurance are the O-A and the O-X visas.
That is correct for the VISA.

Be careful to separate the visa and the permission to stay

They are not the same and using the word visa when you have no current visa will and does cause confusion and will get wrong answers to questions.

Visas can never be extended.
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